5-Mar-11 News -- Russia unleashes 'Black Hawk' vigilantes

[John]

5-Mar-11 News -- Russia unleashes 'Black Hawk' vigilantes against Caucasus terrorists


-- The 'Black Hawks' say they'll target the families of suspected terrorists

** 5-Mar-11 News -- Russia unleashes 'Black Hawk' vigilantes against Caucasus terrorists
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/cgi ... 05#e110305

[vincecate]

Wahhabism is the hard-line sect of Islam adopted by jihadists who distort Islam to justify terrorism.

Note, it is not just some tiny splinter group.

"Wahhabism is the dominant form of Islam in Saudi Arabia.[3] It has developed considerable influence in the Muslim world in part through Saudi funding of mosques, schools and social programs. "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wahhabi

And "distort Islam" is not at all clear. This may be more true to Islam than other forms.

And "adopted by jihadists ... to justify terrorism" makes it sound like they are first terrorists and then become Wahhabi, when usually it is that Wahhabism creates jihadists and terrorists.

[John]

Dear Vince,

> And "adopted by jihadists ... to justify terrorism" makes it sound
> like they are first terrorists and then become Wahhabi, when
> usually it is that Wahhabism creates jihadists and terrorists.

Doku Umarov was a terrorist first, and adopted Wahhabism. The same is
true of the Umarov's followers.

I want to state as strongly as I can how much I disagree with you.
People don't blow up innocent civilians in airports or innocent
civilians in Shia mosques because of something that some 18th century
theologian said, any more than Gbagbo's Roman Catholic police
massacred a peaceful demonstration by women because of something that
some 18th century Pope said.

** 7-Mar-11 News -- Escalating violence in Ivory Coast leads to enlarged U.N. peacekeeping force
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/cgi ... 07#e110307

** American xenophobia on the Left and on the Right
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/cgi ... 07#e101107


** Book review review: Christopher Hitchens: 'God Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything' (I)
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/cgi ... 03#e070603

** Book review review: Christopher Hitchens: 'God Is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything' (II)
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/cgi ... b#e070603b

John

[CrisisEraDynamo]

If you look at the responses to this article on Big Peace, you'll note that a lot of the responses are in support of the Black Hawks, stating that "[t]he Russians are not afflicted with multiculturalism and the politically correct disease that has devastated most of the west" and asking if "[they're] supposed to feel bad because people have finally had enough of Islamic terrorism."

As of this posting, I've yet to see an answer disagreeing.

[John]

> If you look at
> the responses to this article on Big Peace, you'll note that a
> lot of the responses are in support of the Black Hawks,
> stating that "[t]he Russians are not afflicted with
> multiculturalism and the politically correct disease that has
> devastated most of the west" and asking if "[they're] supposed to
> feel bad because people have finally had enough of Islamic
> terrorism."

> As of this posting, I've yet to see an answer disagreeing.

I've been watching the comments as well. Apparently it occurs to none
of them that a rise of the Black Hawks would lead to full-scale war in
the Caucasus, or if it does occur to them, they don't care.

At least no one is calling me a terrorist sympathizer today, at least
so far.

My article on Ivory Coast will appear on BigPeace tomorrow. It'll be
interesting to see the comments to that article.

John

[vincecate]

Doku Umarov was a terrorist first, and adopted Wahhabism. The same is true of the Umarov's followers.

Do you think Islamic terrorist are born or made? Is it nature or nurture that creates Islamic suicide bombers?

Having one guy and his followers join from another branch of Islam in no way refutes my claim that Wahhabism usually creates jihadists and terrorist, instead of having terrorist join fully formed.

People don't blow up innocent civilians in airports or innocent
civilians in Shia mosques because of something that some 18th century
theologian said, [...]

The Saudis are funding lots of places to teach Wahhabism today. So your explanation for the disproportionate representation of Wahhabism amoung jihadists and terrorists is that Islamic guys are becoming jihadists and terrorist and then after just using Wahhabism as justification. So if it is not due to the teachings of Wahhabism, why do you think these Islamic guys are becoming jihadists and terrorists? And if they feel the need for Wahhabism to justify their actions, maybe they would not do terrorism if Wahhabism did not exist, so it could still count as a cause even if it just provides the intellectual cover. It could be like Keynesism providing the intellectual cover enabling the printing money, even though the real reason is the government just likes to spend money.

[John]

Dear Vince,

> John wrote:Doku Umarov was a terrorist first, and adopted
> Wahhabism. The same is true of the Umarov's followers.

> Do you think Islamic terrorist are born or made? Is it nature or
> nurture that creates Islamic suicide bombers?

> Having one guy and his followers join from another branch of Islam
> in no way refutes my claim that Wahhabism usually creates
> jihadists and terrorist, instead of having terrorist join fully
> formed.

I don't have the vaguest idea what a "fully formed" terrorist is.
Someone is a terrorist if he's committed a terrorist act. At what
point in the planning of a terrorist act someone becomes "fully
formed" is beyond me.

Since Wahhabism is widely practiced in Saudi Arabia, I guess you must
believe that almost all Saudis are "fully formed" terrorists. Believe
what you want, Vince.

Is generational behavior nature or nuture? Probably some of both.

> John wrote:People don't blow up innocent civilians in airports or innocent
> civilians in Shia mosques because of something that some 18th century
> theologian said, [...]

> The Saudis are funding lots of places to teach Wahhabism today. So
> your explanation for the disproportionate representation of
> Wahhabism amoung jihadists and terrorists is that Islamic guys are
> becoming jihadists and terrorist and then after just using
> Wahhabism as justification. So if it is not due to the teachings
> of Wahhabism, why do you think these Islamic guys are becoming
> jihadists and terrorists? And if they feel the need for Wahhabism
> to justify their actions, maybe they would not do terrorism if
> Wahhabism did not exist, so it could still count as a cause even
> if it just provides the intellectual cover. It could be like
> Keynesism providing the intellectual cover enabling the printing
> money, even though the real reason is the government just likes to
> spend money.

In quoting me, you extracted a sentence fragment, and thereby changed its
meaning - or made it meaningless.

The complete sentence was:

> People don't blow up innocent civilians in airports or innocent
> civilians in Shia mosques because of something that some 18th
> century theologian said, any more than Gbagbo's Roman Catholic
> police massacred a peaceful demonstration by women because of
> something that some 18th century Pope said.

Similarly, the Japanese didn't bomb Pearl Harbor because some 18th
century Shinto or Buddhist theologian said to.

Terrorism did not begin with Wahhabism, or even with Islam. Every
religion has terrorists, and many terrorists use religion to justify
their actions.

Christians have been slaughtering Jews for centuries, justifying the
slaughter with Bible readings. It's quite possible that Gbagbo is
justifying his slaughter of Muslims based on Bible readers, although
that hasn't been reported.

If you want to commit terrorism, atrocities, mutilation and genocide,
then you need to justify your actions to the public. This usually
means portraying them as inferior in some way. If the people you're
mutilating have different physical characteristics, then you can call
them "dirty," as in the use of "dirty Japs" in World War II.

If you can't use physical characteristics to justify your terrorism
and mutilation, then religion becomes the tool of choice. Christians
used the word "infidel" to justify things like the Crusades and the
St. Bartholomew's Massacre of 1572.

It's interesting to note that as the various "revolutions" occur
around the Arab world today, al-Qaeda and Wahhabism are completely
irrelevant, almost as if they didn't exist. It seems quite possible
that, except for the 9/11 attack, jihadism will turn out to be just a
footnote to the coming world war.

John