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Thread: The Gore Watch - Page 3







Post#51 at 01-16-2006 02:01 PM by Child of Socrates [at Cybrarian from America's Dairyland, 1961 cohort joined Sep 2001 #posts 14,092]
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That is one fucking brilliant speech.







Post#52 at 01-16-2006 02:04 PM by Marx & Lennon [at '47 cohort still lost in Falwelland joined Sep 2001 #posts 16,709]
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Re: Out of the spider, and into the campfire

Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Given a choice, I'll take Al Gore over Mark Warner, though Warner has been a good governor for Virginia. Either is vastly preferable to George "Lock 'em up and throw away the key" Allen, whose one claim to fame is just that - retribution at all costs. That, and his cowboy boots.

If Allen is elected President, I'm going to Canada. :evil:
Say hello to Stephen Harper.

You might have to go south, young man! :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:
H-m-m-m. A Canadian Conservative would be a US Moderate, so I expect he'll do very well.
Marx: Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.
Lennon: You either get tired fighting for peace, or you die.







Post#53 at 01-16-2006 02:04 PM by Marx & Lennon [at '47 cohort still lost in Falwelland joined Sep 2001 #posts 16,709]
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Re: Out of the spider, and into the campfire

Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Given a choice, I'll take Al Gore over Mark Warner, though Warner has been a good governor for Virginia. Either is vastly preferable to George "Lock 'em up and throw away the key" Allen, whose one claim to fame is just that - retribution at all costs. That, and his cowboy boots.

If Allen is elected President, I'm going to Canada. :evil:
Say hello to Stephen Harper.

You might have to go south, young man! :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:
H-m-m-m. A Canadian Conservative would be a US Moderate, so I expect he'll do very well.
Marx: Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.
Lennon: You either get tired fighting for peace, or you die.







Post#54 at 01-16-2006 02:08 PM by Virgil K. Saari [at '49er, north of the Mesabi Mountains joined Jun 2001 #posts 7,835]
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Re: Out of the spider, and into the campfire

Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Given a choice, I'll take Al Gore over Mark Warner, though Warner has been a good governor for Virginia. Either is vastly preferable to George "Lock 'em up and throw away the key" Allen, whose one claim to fame is just that - retribution at all costs. That, and his cowboy boots.

If Allen is elected President, I'm going to Canada. :evil:
Say hello to Stephen Harper.

You might have to go south, young man! :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:
H-m-m-m. A Canadian Conservative would be a US Moderate, so I expect he'll do very well.
Well, I am glad that the present curate's egg of Compassionate Conservativism has kept you at least partially sated.







Post#55 at 01-16-2006 02:08 PM by Virgil K. Saari [at '49er, north of the Mesabi Mountains joined Jun 2001 #posts 7,835]
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Re: Out of the spider, and into the campfire

Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Given a choice, I'll take Al Gore over Mark Warner, though Warner has been a good governor for Virginia. Either is vastly preferable to George "Lock 'em up and throw away the key" Allen, whose one claim to fame is just that - retribution at all costs. That, and his cowboy boots.

If Allen is elected President, I'm going to Canada. :evil:
Say hello to Stephen Harper.

You might have to go south, young man! :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:
H-m-m-m. A Canadian Conservative would be a US Moderate, so I expect he'll do very well.
Well, I am glad that the present curate's egg of Compassionate Conservativism has kept you at least partially sated.







Post#56 at 01-16-2006 03:52 PM by Justin '77 [at Meh. joined Sep 2001 #posts 12,182]
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Quote Originally Posted by The Roadrunner
That is one fucking brilliant speech.
Makes you wonder who wrote it...







Post#57 at 01-16-2006 03:52 PM by Justin '77 [at Meh. joined Sep 2001 #posts 12,182]
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Quote Originally Posted by The Roadrunner
That is one fucking brilliant speech.
Makes you wonder who wrote it...







Post#58 at 01-16-2006 04:32 PM by Child of Socrates [at Cybrarian from America's Dairyland, 1961 cohort joined Sep 2001 #posts 14,092]
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Quote Originally Posted by Justin '77
Quote Originally Posted by The Roadrunner
That is one fucking brilliant speech.
Makes you wonder who wrote it...
He really nailed it here:

But there is yet another Constitutional player whose pulse must be taken and whose role must be examined in order to understand the dangerous imbalance that has emerged with the efforts by the Executive Branch to dominate our constitutional system.

We the people are-collectively-still the key to the survival of America's democracy. We-as Lincoln put it, "[e]ven we here"-must examine our own role as citizens in allowing and not preventing the shocking decay and degradation of our democracy.

Thomas Jefferson said: "An informed citizenry is the only true repository of the public will."

The revolutionary departure on which the idea of America was based was the audacious belief that people can govern themselves and responsibly exercise the ultimate authority in self-government. This insight proceeded inevitably from the bedrock principle articulated by the Enlightenment philosopher John Locke: "All just power is derived from the consent of the governed."

The intricate and carefully balanced constitutional system that is now in such danger was created with the full and widespread participation of the population as a whole. The Federalist Papers were, back in the day, widely-read newspaper essays, and they represented only one of twenty-four series of essays that crowded the vibrant marketplace of ideas in which farmers and shopkeepers recapitulated the debates that played out so fruitfully in Philadelphia.

Indeed, when the Convention had done its best, it was the people - in their various States - that refused to confirm the result until, at their insistence, the Bill of Rights was made integral to the document sent forward for ratification.

And it is "We the people" who must now find once again the ability we once had to play an integral role in saving our Constitution.


I really liked that part. It wasn't enough for Gore to complain about how the government is starting to run roughshod over us -- it was a call to the citizenry to get involved and do something about it. Get informed. Don't believe everything you see on the teevee or read on the internets.







Post#59 at 01-16-2006 04:32 PM by Child of Socrates [at Cybrarian from America's Dairyland, 1961 cohort joined Sep 2001 #posts 14,092]
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Quote Originally Posted by Justin '77
Quote Originally Posted by The Roadrunner
That is one fucking brilliant speech.
Makes you wonder who wrote it...
He really nailed it here:

But there is yet another Constitutional player whose pulse must be taken and whose role must be examined in order to understand the dangerous imbalance that has emerged with the efforts by the Executive Branch to dominate our constitutional system.

We the people are-collectively-still the key to the survival of America's democracy. We-as Lincoln put it, "[e]ven we here"-must examine our own role as citizens in allowing and not preventing the shocking decay and degradation of our democracy.

Thomas Jefferson said: "An informed citizenry is the only true repository of the public will."

The revolutionary departure on which the idea of America was based was the audacious belief that people can govern themselves and responsibly exercise the ultimate authority in self-government. This insight proceeded inevitably from the bedrock principle articulated by the Enlightenment philosopher John Locke: "All just power is derived from the consent of the governed."

The intricate and carefully balanced constitutional system that is now in such danger was created with the full and widespread participation of the population as a whole. The Federalist Papers were, back in the day, widely-read newspaper essays, and they represented only one of twenty-four series of essays that crowded the vibrant marketplace of ideas in which farmers and shopkeepers recapitulated the debates that played out so fruitfully in Philadelphia.

Indeed, when the Convention had done its best, it was the people - in their various States - that refused to confirm the result until, at their insistence, the Bill of Rights was made integral to the document sent forward for ratification.

And it is "We the people" who must now find once again the ability we once had to play an integral role in saving our Constitution.


I really liked that part. It wasn't enough for Gore to complain about how the government is starting to run roughshod over us -- it was a call to the citizenry to get involved and do something about it. Get informed. Don't believe everything you see on the teevee or read on the internets.







Post#60 at 01-16-2006 04:33 PM by Child of Socrates [at Cybrarian from America's Dairyland, 1961 cohort joined Sep 2001 #posts 14,092]
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Argh. I just realized this was a doubled post.

Nevermind, I'll just highlight another part of the Gore speech:

Fear drives out reason. Fear suppresses the politics of discourse and opens the door to the politics of destruction. Justice Brandeis once wrote: "Men feared witches and burnt women."

The founders of our country faced dire threats. If they failed in their endeavors, they would have been hung as traitors. The very existence of our country was at risk.

Yet, in the teeth of those dangers, they insisted on establishing the Bill of Rights.

Is our Congress today in more danger than were their predecessors when the British army was marching on the Capitol? Is the world more dangerous than when we faced an ideological enemy with tens of thousands of missiles poised to be launched against us and annihilate our country at a moment's notice? Is America in more danger now than when we faced worldwide fascism on the march-when our fathers fought and won two World Wars?

It is simply an insult to those who came before us and sacrificed so much on our behalf to imply that we have more to be fearful of than they. Yet they faithfully protected our freedoms and now it is up to us to do the same.







Post#61 at 01-16-2006 04:33 PM by Child of Socrates [at Cybrarian from America's Dairyland, 1961 cohort joined Sep 2001 #posts 14,092]
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Argh. I just realized this was a doubled post.

Nevermind, I'll just highlight another part of the Gore speech:

Fear drives out reason. Fear suppresses the politics of discourse and opens the door to the politics of destruction. Justice Brandeis once wrote: "Men feared witches and burnt women."

The founders of our country faced dire threats. If they failed in their endeavors, they would have been hung as traitors. The very existence of our country was at risk.

Yet, in the teeth of those dangers, they insisted on establishing the Bill of Rights.

Is our Congress today in more danger than were their predecessors when the British army was marching on the Capitol? Is the world more dangerous than when we faced an ideological enemy with tens of thousands of missiles poised to be launched against us and annihilate our country at a moment's notice? Is America in more danger now than when we faced worldwide fascism on the march-when our fathers fought and won two World Wars?

It is simply an insult to those who came before us and sacrificed so much on our behalf to imply that we have more to be fearful of than they. Yet they faithfully protected our freedoms and now it is up to us to do the same.







Post#62 at 01-16-2006 06:01 PM by jadams [at the tropics joined Feb 2003 #posts 1,097]
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I have been watching Gore's speeches these last couple of years. On every issue, he alone, is addressing the heart of the problems facing our nation, our planet and our democracy. He aint good looking, and he is still stiff and still southern. But he is THE MAN!
jadams

"Can it be believed that the democracy that has overthrown the feudal system and vanquished kings will retreat before tradesmen and capitalists?" Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America







Post#63 at 01-16-2006 06:01 PM by jadams [at the tropics joined Feb 2003 #posts 1,097]
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I have been watching Gore's speeches these last couple of years. On every issue, he alone, is addressing the heart of the problems facing our nation, our planet and our democracy. He aint good looking, and he is still stiff and still southern. But he is THE MAN!
jadams

"Can it be believed that the democracy that has overthrown the feudal system and vanquished kings will retreat before tradesmen and capitalists?" Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America







Post#64 at 01-16-2006 06:03 PM by Virgil K. Saari [at '49er, north of the Mesabi Mountains joined Jun 2001 #posts 7,835]
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Would you buy a used Constitution from this guy?








Post#65 at 01-16-2006 06:03 PM by Virgil K. Saari [at '49er, north of the Mesabi Mountains joined Jun 2001 #posts 7,835]
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Would you buy a used Constitution from this guy?








Post#66 at 01-16-2006 06:31 PM by Uzi [at joined Oct 2005 #posts 2,254]
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So Saari are you going to vote for Halonen or Ninistö on Jan. 29?
"It's easy to grin, when your ship's come in, and you've got the stock market beat. But the man who's worth while is the man who can smile when his pants are too tight in the seat." Judge Smails, Caddyshack.

"Every man with a bellyful of the classics is an enemy of the human race." Henry Miller.

1979 - Generation Perdu







Post#67 at 01-16-2006 06:31 PM by Uzi [at joined Oct 2005 #posts 2,254]
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So Saari are you going to vote for Halonen or Ninistö on Jan. 29?
"It's easy to grin, when your ship's come in, and you've got the stock market beat. But the man who's worth while is the man who can smile when his pants are too tight in the seat." Judge Smails, Caddyshack.

"Every man with a bellyful of the classics is an enemy of the human race." Henry Miller.

1979 - Generation Perdu







Post#68 at 01-16-2006 06:39 PM by Virgil K. Saari [at '49er, north of the Mesabi Mountains joined Jun 2001 #posts 7,835]
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If I were a citizen,

Quote Originally Posted by Mary Fitzmas
So Saari are you going to vote for Halonen or Ninistö on Jan. 29?
I might be a True Finn/Perussuomalaiset sort of Tertium Quid.

Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
This populist movement is very nationalist, eurosceptic and anti-establishment.
:wink:







Post#69 at 01-16-2006 06:39 PM by Virgil K. Saari [at '49er, north of the Mesabi Mountains joined Jun 2001 #posts 7,835]
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If I were a citizen,

Quote Originally Posted by Mary Fitzmas
So Saari are you going to vote for Halonen or Ninistö on Jan. 29?
I might be a True Finn/Perussuomalaiset sort of Tertium Quid.

Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
This populist movement is very nationalist, eurosceptic and anti-establishment.
:wink:







Post#70 at 01-16-2006 10:04 PM by The Pervert [at A D&D Character sheet joined Jan 2002 #posts 1,169]
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Re: Out of the spider, and into the campfire

Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Given a choice, I'll take Al Gore over Mark Warner, though Warner has been a good governor for Virginia. Either is vastly preferable to George "Lock 'em up and throw away the key" Allen, whose one claim to fame is just that - retribution at all costs. That, and his cowboy boots.

If Allen is elected President, I'm going to Canada. :evil:
Say hello to Stephen Harper.

You might have to go south, young man! :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:
H-m-m-m. A Canadian Conservative would be a US Moderate, so I expect he'll do very well.
Well, I am glad that the present curate's egg of Compassionate Conservativism has kept you at least partially sated.

Quote Originally Posted by Anne McIlroy of the Guardian UK
But a Conservative victory will not signal a dramatic shift to the right for the country, at least according to Mr Harper's campaign announcements. The Conservatives are a merger of two parties, the more populist and socially conservative Canadian Alliance and the more mainstream Progressive Conservatives, who were all but destroyed in the 1993 election after the deeply unpopular Brian Mulroney stepped down as prime minister.

...

The Globe and Mail, a respected national newspaper, endorsed Mr Harper at the weekend.

The paper noted that he has moved to the middle of the political spectrum and that policies he has spelled out on health care, other social programmes and tax cuts are reasonable. The Conservative leader has managed to defuse concerns that he has a socially conservative hidden agenda. He insists the Conservatives will not reopen the abortion debate, for example.
As someone who has spent a good deal of time in Canada (my landed immigrant girlfriend lives in Kitchener), I can vouch for this. A Canada under Conservative rule would still be more liberal in many ways that the United States under Democratic rule.
Your local general nuisance
"I am not an alter ego. I am an unaltered id!"







Post#71 at 01-16-2006 10:04 PM by The Pervert [at A D&D Character sheet joined Jan 2002 #posts 1,169]
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Re: Out of the spider, and into the campfire

Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Quote Originally Posted by Virgil K. Saari
Quote Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon
Given a choice, I'll take Al Gore over Mark Warner, though Warner has been a good governor for Virginia. Either is vastly preferable to George "Lock 'em up and throw away the key" Allen, whose one claim to fame is just that - retribution at all costs. That, and his cowboy boots.

If Allen is elected President, I'm going to Canada. :evil:
Say hello to Stephen Harper.

You might have to go south, young man! :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:
H-m-m-m. A Canadian Conservative would be a US Moderate, so I expect he'll do very well.
Well, I am glad that the present curate's egg of Compassionate Conservativism has kept you at least partially sated.

Quote Originally Posted by Anne McIlroy of the Guardian UK
But a Conservative victory will not signal a dramatic shift to the right for the country, at least according to Mr Harper's campaign announcements. The Conservatives are a merger of two parties, the more populist and socially conservative Canadian Alliance and the more mainstream Progressive Conservatives, who were all but destroyed in the 1993 election after the deeply unpopular Brian Mulroney stepped down as prime minister.

...

The Globe and Mail, a respected national newspaper, endorsed Mr Harper at the weekend.

The paper noted that he has moved to the middle of the political spectrum and that policies he has spelled out on health care, other social programmes and tax cuts are reasonable. The Conservative leader has managed to defuse concerns that he has a socially conservative hidden agenda. He insists the Conservatives will not reopen the abortion debate, for example.
As someone who has spent a good deal of time in Canada (my landed immigrant girlfriend lives in Kitchener), I can vouch for this. A Canada under Conservative rule would still be more liberal in many ways that the United States under Democratic rule.
Your local general nuisance
"I am not an alter ego. I am an unaltered id!"







Post#72 at 01-17-2006 01:39 AM by albatross '82 [at Portland, OR joined Sep 2005 #posts 248]
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gore, reagan, clinton, clinton.

Quote Originally Posted by jadams
I have been watching Gore's speeches these last couple of years. On every issue, he alone, is addressing the heart of the problems facing our nation, our planet and our democracy. He aint good looking, and he is still stiff and still southern. But he is THE MAN!
Southern is good though, right? How many presidents have been southern in the past 30 years? Other than Reagan, all of them.

Speaking of Reagan, I think he was GC material. I don't actually know much about his presidency, but he seems to have been a straight shooter, for better or worse. He seemed to be a pretty natural leader. That's probably why he was missed so much when he died--in the land of 2004, there were no true leaders to be found. But alas, he was a G.I. and not meant for The 4T Hall Of Fame. Hell, he wasn't even supposed to be in The 3T Hall Of Fame, but those goddamn G.I.'s just wouldn't go away!

But Gore, he really is one of the few people out there willing to stick his neck out. I do not see Hillary Clinton being a good leader. She's all politics, and would Hooverize this country even more than Bush, especially since if she is elected in '08, she will likely be president during the regeneracy. This would at least mean that Gore could pick up the pieces in 2012 and kick some ass. Unless the world ends on 12/21/12...oh wait, I'm not on the prophecies board. :lol:

There is also the remote possibility that Bill Clinton could become president again. Something I noticed when reading about Israel's history is how much they've had recurring PMs. I mean, there's already talk of Netanyahu being the next PM, and he had a first turn in the late 90s. Clinton has even pointed out that there's nothing in the Constitution that says a former president can't make a comeback years later. He's been keeping a pretty high profile too--I think it's possible. People could associate him with the good times of the 1990s and give him another go. However, I still don't think he's a crisis leader. I think maybe he just misses the 90s, like the rest of us (except for some of you Xers :P).

Gore is our man. Sign some petitions, make it happen.







Post#73 at 01-17-2006 01:39 AM by albatross '82 [at Portland, OR joined Sep 2005 #posts 248]
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gore, reagan, clinton, clinton.

Quote Originally Posted by jadams
I have been watching Gore's speeches these last couple of years. On every issue, he alone, is addressing the heart of the problems facing our nation, our planet and our democracy. He aint good looking, and he is still stiff and still southern. But he is THE MAN!
Southern is good though, right? How many presidents have been southern in the past 30 years? Other than Reagan, all of them.

Speaking of Reagan, I think he was GC material. I don't actually know much about his presidency, but he seems to have been a straight shooter, for better or worse. He seemed to be a pretty natural leader. That's probably why he was missed so much when he died--in the land of 2004, there were no true leaders to be found. But alas, he was a G.I. and not meant for The 4T Hall Of Fame. Hell, he wasn't even supposed to be in The 3T Hall Of Fame, but those goddamn G.I.'s just wouldn't go away!

But Gore, he really is one of the few people out there willing to stick his neck out. I do not see Hillary Clinton being a good leader. She's all politics, and would Hooverize this country even more than Bush, especially since if she is elected in '08, she will likely be president during the regeneracy. This would at least mean that Gore could pick up the pieces in 2012 and kick some ass. Unless the world ends on 12/21/12...oh wait, I'm not on the prophecies board. :lol:

There is also the remote possibility that Bill Clinton could become president again. Something I noticed when reading about Israel's history is how much they've had recurring PMs. I mean, there's already talk of Netanyahu being the next PM, and he had a first turn in the late 90s. Clinton has even pointed out that there's nothing in the Constitution that says a former president can't make a comeback years later. He's been keeping a pretty high profile too--I think it's possible. People could associate him with the good times of the 1990s and give him another go. However, I still don't think he's a crisis leader. I think maybe he just misses the 90s, like the rest of us (except for some of you Xers :P).

Gore is our man. Sign some petitions, make it happen.







Post#74 at 01-17-2006 02:18 AM by Andy '85 [at Texas joined Aug 2003 #posts 1,465]
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The speech made was refreshing. Good to see him cool down so his mind is clear of distractions, and even better to see a hand extended across both aisles. He knows everyone has a stake in this nation. Maybe we'll see some new direction yet. A shakeup of the current arrangement is in order.

He has my nod. Should he run I would vote for him on the issues presented in his speech (I'm still skeptical about his environmental platform, but that's a small issue). But I am amused to see how those a bit towards my left from all sorts of places are falling over themselves in reaction to this. Coat him in bronze and put him on a pedestal!
Right-Wing liberal, slow progressive, and other contradictions straddling both the past and future, but out of touch with the present . . .

"We also know there are known unknowns.
That is to say, we know there are some things we do not know." - Donald Rumsfeld







Post#75 at 01-17-2006 02:18 AM by Andy '85 [at Texas joined Aug 2003 #posts 1,465]
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The speech made was refreshing. Good to see him cool down so his mind is clear of distractions, and even better to see a hand extended across both aisles. He knows everyone has a stake in this nation. Maybe we'll see some new direction yet. A shakeup of the current arrangement is in order.

He has my nod. Should he run I would vote for him on the issues presented in his speech (I'm still skeptical about his environmental platform, but that's a small issue). But I am amused to see how those a bit towards my left from all sorts of places are falling over themselves in reaction to this. Coat him in bronze and put him on a pedestal!
Right-Wing liberal, slow progressive, and other contradictions straddling both the past and future, but out of touch with the present . . .

"We also know there are known unknowns.
That is to say, we know there are some things we do not know." - Donald Rumsfeld
-----------------------------------------