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Thread: Crazy Russia - Page 18







Post#426 at 05-19-2011 03:19 AM by Uzi [at joined Oct 2005 #posts 2,254]
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05-19-2011, 03:19 AM #426
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I'm sure there are people our age who are grandparents already, especially in Russia. Not many, but a few.







Post#427 at 05-19-2011 12:13 PM by Justin '77 [at Meh. joined Sep 2001 #posts 12,182]
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05-19-2011, 12:13 PM #427
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I know people in America who were grandparents already at our age. Not many, indeed. But a few.

But seriously, being a grandparent at not-even-old-enough-to-be-President never struck me as a sign of being 'old'. More one of being a fuckup.
"Qu'est-ce que c'est que cela, la loi ? On peut donc être dehors. Je ne comprends pas. Quant à moi, suis-je dans la loi ? suis-je hors la loi ? Je n'en sais rien. Mourir de faim, est-ce être dans la loi ?" -- Tellmarch

"Человек не может снять с себя ответственности за свои поступки." - L. Tolstoy

"[it]
is no doubt obvious, the cult of the experts is both self-serving, for those who propound it, and fraudulent." - Noam Chomsky







Post#428 at 05-20-2011 03:17 AM by Uzi [at joined Oct 2005 #posts 2,254]
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05-20-2011, 03:17 AM #428
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I guess we are already too old to be fuck ups (or that fucked up, rather). By the time my eldest daughter is 20, I'll be 44. A genuine geezer.







Post#429 at 08-12-2011 09:28 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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08-12-2011, 09:28 PM #429
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Scroll down to Russian/Soviet counterculture







Post#430 at 12-07-2011 09:47 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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As I recall, John Xenakis listed The Time of Troubles as a Crisis. It seems to have been triggered by the Little Iced Age.Russia The Once and Future Empire from Pre-History to Putin by Philip Longworthchaper 6. The CrashAfter the death of Ivan the Terrible:"Historians often attribute Russia's descent into anarchy in the early 1600s to Ivan's misrule, yet the tyrant's death did not mark the onset of what Russians call 'the era of confusion' and we in the West know as the 'Time of Troubles'. Instead, there was something of a recovery. However disappointing the terms that ended the Livonian war may have been politically, the conclusion of hostilities the year before Ivan's death eased the economic pressure on the country. Recognition that the terror of Ivan's oprichnina had gone for good gave hope to many; there was a breathing space, a chance to stabilize the country after the disruptions of the oprichnina - and the new tsar's government seized the opportunity.







Post#431 at 12-07-2011 09:54 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-07-2011, 09:54 PM #431
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chapter 6. continued. "Economic activity revived...the weight of government demands on the peasantry was lightened. "The new domestic policy sought to establish internal calm after all the recent storms. It was paralleled by a foreign policy which guarded Russia's essential interests without requiring massive mobilization of resources. Dangerous ambition was abandoned, and feelers were put out to countries far and near offering co-operation for mutual benefit.... "If Ivan's misrule had made a collase inevitable, the measures taken under is successor kept disaster at bay, and when the reckoning eventually came it was to be precipitated and deepened by factors independent of Ivan's actions - by 'acts of God' that were quite unforeseeable."







Post#432 at 12-07-2011 10:00 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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chapter 6 continued. "The cause was not the legacy of Ivan the Terrible, though this contributed to the disaster...The fundamental reason was a change in weather patterns known as the Little Ice Age. Bad weather caused repeated famines and associated ecological problems and pandemics. This in turn affected agriculture, and promoted migrations and public discontent. Soon social distress spilled over into political protest...Events unfolded inexorably, as in a Greek tragedy."







Post#433 at 12-12-2011 04:41 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-12-2011, 04:41 PM #433
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Chapter 6 continued. "In 1598 Tsar Fedor died, and his death precipitated a crisis for the state. Fedor was the last of his line...Fedor had died without leaving an heir...There were several hopefuls. Some, including the Romanovs and Nagois, were related to Ivan's wives; others, like Prince Vasilii Shuiskii, claimed both distinguished ancestry and minsterial experience....Boris Godunov, though not of princely descent, was also a candidate...On 3 September 1598 Boris was enthroned as tsar amid general acclamations...Potential rivals - including several Nagois and Romanovs - were taken under escort to distant prisons, an amnesty for common criminals was declared, a tax holiday was granted, and largesse was distributed to widows, ophans, foreigners in Russia's service and the people of Moscow. So Russia aquired an able, legitimate tsar. A succession crisis had been averted....Yet the seven lean years that followed were lean indeed, and by the time they ended Boris was dead, his heir murdered, the realm in ruins, and the enemy at the gate."







Post#434 at 12-12-2011 04:48 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-12-2011, 04:48 PM #434
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Chapter 6. "They began with a severe drought in the first summer of Boris's reign, and then fire struck the dried-out timbers of the still largely wooden city of Moscow. The winter of 1600 was long and very cold, particularly in the south and west, and then there was a spate of unusually heavy storms. The consequence was famine, but not disaster. Russians were no strangers to cruel weather and the destructive forces of nature. They resowed, repaired, eked out what they had left, borrowed if they had to. The urban population suffered when the price of bread rose, but, like the government of ancient Rome, the Russian tsardom made provision when hunger threatened. There had been localized famine before, and a widespread one in the winter of 1587-8, without causing any long term trauma. This time it was different."







Post#435 at 12-12-2011 04:55 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-12-2011, 04:55 PM #435
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"Disaster struck not once or twice, but year in, year out. The summer of 1601 was extremely wet. Day after day 'rain fell without stopping, and the rye and the spring wheat got sodden and lay on the ground all winter.' Around Moscow itself there were heavy frosts in late July, and every type of grain and vegetable was frozen. Now was the disaster localized...In 1602 there was another drought, followed by violent storms and floods so great that even the very old could not remember their like. Then blights struck and epidemics, and every year now seemed a year of famine...Climate change and the series of weather disasters precipitated a social catastrophe, and political debacle flowed from it. Tales about...the 'usurper' Boris only gained currency in the wake of the great hunger."







Post#436 at 12-12-2011 05:01 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"Far from being to blame, Boris did everything within his power to alleviate his people's suffering. He campaigned against speculators who hoarded grain waiting for the price to rise; he sold grain cheaply from his own granaries; he sent out messages of encouragement...doled out large sums to the needy from his own treasury. But luck had deserted him: the grain he sold cheaply was often resold for private gain; as news of his largesse spread, more and more poor peasants croweded into the city in expectation of his charity, compounding the problems. Whatever was done was never enough...."







Post#437 at 12-12-2011 05:07 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"The continuing period of abnormal weather precipitated not only famine and disease, but also a social and demographic crisis. Marginal farmers, peasants no longer able to pay their rents and taxes, or even feed themselves, abandoned their holdings and took to the road. The number of beggars, vagabonds and robbers multiplied, and they became more desperate. There was another, relatively sharp, population shift - this time from north to south, and particularly to the frontier lands. And it was from the southwest frontier that the first political challenge emerged in the autumn of 1604: a claimant to the throne who called himself Dmitrii and said he had escaped death at Uglich. From then on Boris's days were numbered."







Post#438 at 12-14-2011 01:20 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-14-2011, 01:20 PM #438
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Chapter 6. "Quite how a popular political rebellion got under way in a country governed by a relatively efficient, centralized monarchy, among a people that was largely illiterate, has never been satisfactorily explained. It has been suggested, however, that rumor served as a substitute for modern media in early modern Russia, and that many if not most of the political rumours that gained currency were started by politicians anxious to manipulate popular opinin and, indeed, to trigger popular protests...."As we have seen, a series of natural disasters was disrupting the Russian economy and society. It was also bleeding the state of funds and raising doubts about the legitimacy of its government. But a rebellion against a God-sanctioned emperor had somehow to be justified. Hence the appearance of a pretender - someone claiming to be the Tsarevich Dmitrii miraculously rescued from death in 1591 and therefore Russia's legitimate God-given ruler in this time of troubles....







Post#439 at 12-14-2011 01:26 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-14-2011, 01:26 PM #439
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The False Demitrii was at the head of a rebellion, which included unpaid soldiers. This triggered retribution. Then Tsar Boris died. The rebellion was still significant in the south. "...Boris's reign had been marred by catastrophes of every kind. With the false Dmitrii as tsar the people hoped for better. They never got it. "...On 20 June 1605 'Dmitrii' entered Moscow, heading a large parade. He was solemnly crowned tsar on the following day. But his own days were numbered, and he was not to last a year."







Post#440 at 12-14-2011 01:32 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"Dmitrii may not have been as evil as most Russians came to paint him...However, his association with Poles and Jesuits was regarded with deep suspicion, as was his marriage to the Catholic Marina...A scuffle between wedding guests in which a Russian met his death at the hands of the visitors triggered a violent reaction...." The False Dmitrii was killed.







Post#441 at 12-14-2011 01:35 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"Vasilii Shuiskii became tsar (as Vasilii IV), and a new patriarch, called Hermogen, was installed. The twin pillars of the state were in place again, and for the first time in seven years the weather was normal. But the effects of the revolutions in climate and politics were still evident in endemic discontent, and the new tsar failed to establish his legitimacy in the eyes of the people...."







Post#442 at 12-14-2011 01:40 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"In the summer of 1607 crowds gained the upper hand over the forces of law and order as another great rebellion welled up from the south...The south was in perpetual revolt, and the central Volga region was soon up in arms too...by October Moscow itself was under siege by rebels. As a result, food prices rose to famine heights inside the city. Tsar Vasillii Shuikii was saved only by a rift in the rebels' ranks. The gentry among them were becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the leveling instincts of the lower orders, and soon went over to him. Thanks to them the siege of Moscow was broken, and the rebels were routed."







Post#443 at 12-14-2011 01:46 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"Nevertheless, huge swathes of the country were under rebel control, and the government's tax income was falling steadily. Then a spurious 'Tsarevich Petr', arrived at the rebel base of Putivl...Then a second false Dmitrii make an appearance near the Polish frontier. Who he really was is still a mystery, but he and his 'retainers' were well rehearsed in a repertoire of theatrical tricks designed to convince onlookers that he really was the rightful tsar, and he soon boasted an army that included mercenaries from Lithuania and Zaporozhian Cossacks, as well as the usual motley array of angry peasants and slaves, othe Cossacks and would-be Cossacks."







Post#444 at 12-14-2011 01:56 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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Events became very tangled. Polish troops joined the forces of the second false Dmitrii, whose HQ was now less than 10 miles from Moscow. Marina, the widow of the first false Dmitrii, decided to 'recognize' the second false Dmitrii. This second false Dmitrii now dominated over half the country. But he lacked the wherewithal to pay and supply his troops, who resorted confiscations and robbery. Then the Tsar in Moscow decided to cede territory to Sweden in return for the services of a force of mercenaries. The Kind of Poland now moved openly to sieze the great frontier citadel of Smolensk. "Russia's neighbours were beginning moving in like jackals on a dying beast to dismember the empire. And still the chaotic civil war continued...."







Post#445 at 12-14-2011 02:00 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"The damage to agriculture and the economy was as bad as the political damage. This was partly because of the disruption of the civil wars, but partly also the result of a renewal of vicious weather conditions. In 1607 there were floods in the Moscow region and deep frosts in western Russia, which prevented the germination of seedcorn and so precipitated another famine. In 1608 the crops in both central and western Russia were destroyed by a bitterly cold winter and heavy rainstorms in summer and autumn which washed out the harvest. There were epidemics and outbreaks of animal diseases that year too, and raging fires caused by lightning."







Post#446 at 12-14-2011 02:11 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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12-14-2011, 02:11 PM #446
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Power brokens in Moscow rejected the continued leadership of Tsar Vasilii, who was forced to become a monk. They also rejected 'Dmitrii'. A ministeral council of seven boyars assumed the task of running the country. Their choice for a new Tsar was the Polish prince Wladyaw, who had indicated his willingness to convert to Orthodoxy, as tsar. However, by now Wladyaw decided to conquer Russia outright, and other powerful Russians opposed his candidacy any way. "At last Zokiewski, commander of Polish forces...decided on a coup de main. He persuaded the more important potential Russian candidates to form a delegation to King Sigismund at Smolensk to discuss Wladyslaw's election - and then had them arrested. So Vasilii Golitsyn, Filaret Romanov and others - including ex-tsar Vasilii Shuiskii - found themselves prisoners in Poland, where some of them were soon to die in mysterious circumstances."







Post#447 at 12-14-2011 02:18 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"Curiously enough it was Poland's new role as the arbiter of Russia's fate that served as a catalyst for Russia's political recovery. Whatever Russians, including the rebels, thought of their rulers, the tsars were at least Orthodox Christians. People reacted strongly against Poland because it was Roman Catholic and predatory. As he made clear in a message to Pope Paul V, King Sigismund aimed to accomplish what his predecessor Stefan Bathory had failed to do: to gain dominion over Russia and return it 'from error and schism to obedience to the Holy See'. Sigismund revived the idea 'all the more ardently since in additon to all the other enormous benefits that would accrue to Christendom from the subjugation of Moscow' it would help him regain control of Sweden. The old revulsion felt by Orthodox Russians at the prospect of 'Latinization' welled up again, and was given more force by the behavior of Polish troops in Russia. These sentiments were exploited with energy by the Russian Church to form one plank of a springboard to recovery. Another came spontaneously from Russian servicemen and government functionaries."







Post#448 at 12-14-2011 02:28 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"But even now the agony did not end. Swedish forces invaded, laid siege to Novgorod, and eventually took it. The Poles captured Smolensk, and Polish troops were still in Moscow...."







Post#449 at 12-14-2011 02:33 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"...The Patriarch had been imprisoned by the Poles, yet a call to arms was issued in October 1611 by the abbot of the Trinity St Sergius Monastery at Zagorsk, and metropolitans, bishops and abbots across the land echoed his call. Even before that, scribes in towns throughout the realm wrote letters on behalf of local governors and other notables, setting out the purpose of a mobilization, explaining the means, and trying to co-ordinate it. 'We should take oaths ourselves, and get the Tartars and Ostiaks to swear their Muslim oath, so that...we make common cause with them...against the Poles and Lithuanians.'..."







Post#450 at 12-14-2011 02:37 PM by TimWalker [at joined May 2007 #posts 6,368]
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"In August 1612 the army - over 10,000 strong, but not particularly well equipped - arrived outside Moscow. It soon engaged the Polish forces...forcing them into retreat. It also halted King Sigismund when he approached with an army...." In Moscow the Polish garrison surrendered.A Romanov was chosen as the new Tsar.
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