I previously thought we were in 4th Turning.

But I think it's more accurate to say we are neither in true 4th nor true 3rd Turning.

Too much has changed for use to go back to 3rd Turning.

And too little has changed to say we are still in 4th Turning.

The urgency of abortion is now replaced with the urgency of fighting terrorism. Even if people do lampoon it on SNL.

We may be in a kind of transition period similar to 1964 or 1965 when the next Social Moment hadn't shown in full force but the tremors were starting to be felt amidst the sunny mood of outwardly-High America.

I think the same thing is happening now with Fourth Turning tremors and an earthquake or two amidst Unraveling-era carnivals still outwardly going full force.


I personally prefer the Third goes on a little while longer. That taste of what the Fourth has brought really doesn't warm my heart. And I'm glad we no longer have the ridiculous comparisons to 1940's America on TV anymore. Except maybe for comparing Ashcroft to Ed Hoover.

"I interrupted to ask, 'Is the terrorist threat on their minds?'" --David Broder

What 9/11? is the distinct impression I get from this opinion in the Washington Post.

Guns and butter don't seemed to be playing in Pretoria this year. With his approval number still up in the record stratosphere, perhaps the great mass just want Dubya to handle the guns while passing the bread and butter, huh?

Sign of 3T or 4t?
Arab Groups Demand Armey Apology for Remarks About Palestinians

I have to admit I will have to disagree with pro-israel people just this once.

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewPolitics....20020503b.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On 2002-05-05 17:54, Marc Lamb wrote:
Guns and butter don't seemed to be playing in Pretoria this year.

Er, Pretoria is in South Africa.

You probably meant "Peoria", a town in central Illinois.

(Note for foreigners: in the rhetorical question "But will in play in Peoria?", Peoria is used to represent small-town America, or the American "heartland", or some such.)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: firemind on 2002-05-06 09:05 ]</font>

On 2002-05-06 09:03, firemind wrote:

Er, Pretoria is in South Africa.

You probably meant "Peoria", a town in central Illinois.

(Note for foreigners: in the rhetorical question "But will in play in Peoria?", Peoria is used to represent small-town America, or the American "heartland", or some such.)

Nowadays, I would guess that said rhetorical question would have to be rephrased, 'But will it play in Plano (Texas)?'. BTW, Plano is just north of Dallas.

Has Peoria become cosmopolitan and sophisticated when I wasn't looking? Or is it just that the alliteration is stronger with "Plano"?

On 2002-05-06 09:34, firemind wrote:
Has Peoria become cosmopolitan and sophisticated when I wasn't looking? Or is it just that the alliteration is stronger with "Plano"?

Well, I'm sure that Peoria sports a number of Starbucks and Borders book stores. However, I suspect that Plano also does. :lol:

On 2002-05-06 09:34, firemind wrote:
Has Peoria become cosmopolitan and sophisticated when I wasn't looking? Or is it just that the alliteration is stronger with "Plano"?

To paraphrase author Michael Lind, the staid Midwest has given way to the haunted South as the symbolic American 'heartland' of right-wing fame, at least partially. With that in mind, I initially thought of Pascagoula, Mississippi, and then Pensacola, Florida, before settling on Plano, Texas.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: jds1958xg on 2002-05-06 09:43 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: jds1958xg on 2002-05-06 19:21 ]</font>

"Er, Pretoria is in South Africa."

One would have thought I would have known considering the words in one of my favorite tunes during the Awakening:

<center>From Capetown, to Pretoria, to Johannesburg
There is a crying, of people dying, that can be heard.
I hear the gunfire, see the blood run, smell the fear.
You lock your minds up, shut the curtains, you close your ears.
<FONT SIZE="-1">The Ressurection Band, 1979</FONT></center>


But then again, perhaps I'm still stuck in the twilight of the grand Industrial Age of 1964, huh?

Sen. Joseph McCarthy's godchild wants to be a Governor. 3T or 4T?

On 2002-05-06 14:45, Virgil K. Saari wrote:
Sen. Joseph McCarthy's godchild wants to be a Governor. 3T or 4T?

Looks 3rd turning to me.

4th Turning And Silent Worries

Buffett issues nuclear alert

Financial staff
Monday May 6, 2002
The Guardian

Warren Buffett, the stock market guru known as the Sage of Omaha, says that businesses and insurers should prepare themselves for a nuclear attack by terrorists.
Mr Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway investment vehicle and other insurers absorbed $70bn (?48bn) of losses from the destruction of the World Trade Centre towers and he believes worse could come.

The 71-year-old warned that many businesses are not covered for chemical, nuclear or biological attack.

"The capability to strike using nuclear, chemical or biological devices isn't there yet but it will be," he said at his three-day annual meeting for investors, which has been dubbed Woodstock for Capitalists.

"People are working on it. It could make the World Trade Centre loss look like nothing.

"We are excluding nuclear, chemical and biological events in terrorism insurance. The twin towers came close to the limit of what we can do. We cannot do nuclear, chemical and biological. We will take an occasional nuclear risk if they'll pay us enough.

"It's strange that financial institutions want terrorism insurance but they're not willing to buy what I'm worried about."

Berkshire's main business is insurance and Mr Buffett makes the company's investments with the money from insurance premiums.

The company has started to recover the financial ground it lost from insurance claims after September 11. Its underwriters lost $2.4bn from the attacks.

Insurance premiums held by Berkshire before payouts grew by $1.8bn in the quarter ended March 31. The company had an underwriting profit of $20m during the period.

Mr Buffett holds stock in wide range of companies, including Coca-Cola, American Express, Dairy Queen fast-food restaurants, NetJets fractional jet-ownership and the Washington Post. His company also owns furniture, paint, shoe and carpeting companies.

Last year Berkshire made $795m, or $521 per share, despite the insurance losses. One share costs about $74,000.

Each year about 10,000 shareholders travel from all parts of the world to Berkshire's annual convention.

On Saturday, Mr Buffett and his 78-year-old deputy, Charlie Munger, spent six hours answering investors' questions, with just one short break.

Also Fourth Turning

US expands Axle of Elvis

And Speech isn't even given by President

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/wor...00/1971852.stm

Comments on Buffet's prediction:



Not that I necessarily disagree with the likelihood of increased action against the US/its residents, but doesn't it seem a little predictable that Mr. Buffet, a major holder in more than one insurance company, would be drumming up a market for 'terrorism insurance'? Will that come with the anti-rust coating?

Here's some evidence of a 4T: the new Spiderman movie. No, really, I'm serious. The plot is remarkably unsarcastic; most of the movies of the Nineties that were based on old series felt the need to overdramatize the stories, either ridiculously (The Brady Bunch) or more subtly (Mission Impossible). If this movie had been made in the mid-Nineties, it would have had Spiderman acting like an idiot; if it had been made in the Eighties, it would have had a corny "gee whiz, just 'cause I'm a superhero doesn't mean I can't have a normal life" theme. This movie shows more respect toward the original concept.

Hugh Heffner and Girls Spread

http://channels.netscape.com/ns/tv/realitytv.jsp

Sign of Third Turning?

:wink:

http://www.indystar.com/article.php?napathy10.html

Heres some good evidence we are still 3T.

This is kinda scary.

Is it sign of the 4th?

http://schumer.senate.gov/SchumerWeb...s/PR00844.html

On 2002-05-10 08:39, JayN wrote:
This is kinda scary.

Is it sign of the 4th?

http://schumer.senate.gov/SchumerWeb...s/PR00844.html

Or just 3T hysteria?

On 2002-05-10 08:44, mmailliw wrote:

On 2002-05-10 08:39, JayN wrote:
This is kinda scary.

Is it sign of the 4th?

http://schumer.senate.gov/SchumerWeb...s/PR00844.html

Or just 3T hysteria?

A few weeks ago, 125,000 attempts were made in one day to hack into the computer system of Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in Dayton.

As to who the hacker(s) was/were, no answer yet.

http://www.xatrix.org/article1297.html

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SJ on 2002-05-10 10:36 ]</font>

The timing of this article is interesting.

It was written September 10.

It discusses the future for Singapore.

http://straitstimes.asia1.com.sg/col...-69462,00.html

I guess the *conservative* arguments for smaller government have backfired. When they ask for bigger government the American people aren't quite engaged with them.

http://www.strike-the-root.com/colum...bottoms18.html

Fourth Turning or Third Turning?

Iran is negotiating secretly with US

http://www.khilafah.com/home/categor...D=4060&TagID=2

Two articles showing 4th turning mentality.

http://slate.msn.com/?id=2065629 = Justice vs. Terrorists need to be destroyed

http://slate.msn.com/?id=2065593 = The "Good man" theory of the presidency vs. the "Great man" theory.

Both of these off the slate on msn.com



<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Balanceman on 2002-05-11 14:11 ]</font>

On 2002-05-09 23:37, JayN wrote:
Hugh Heffner and Girls Spread

http://channels.netscape.com/ns/tv/realitytv.jsp

Sign of Third Turning?

:wink:

Yeah, or maybe it's just our nature as guys to like to look at women :smile:
Besides, all those great pin up posters during WW2 were made in a crisis...


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Balanceman on 2002-05-11 14:14 ]</font>