Originally Posted by Eric the Green

Global warming strikes again. I know, one tornado doesn't prove global warming. But it's just one more, and maybe the biggest ever. I feel for the victims out in Moore Oklahoma. I am thankful they are getting help. I pray for the 24 who died.

The May 3, 1999 tornado that struck pretty much the same area was bigger.

On the other hand, I am mindful that the people of Oklahoma voted for this. Here are some facts. Their two senators voted against aid to the victims of hurricane Sandy (though the local representative voted for it). They are against FEMA, which is now doing a great job there according to news reports. Sen. Imhoff is the leading climate-change denier in Washington. The school where 7 children died was not required to have a storm shelter. Save some taxes and avoid "government forcing people to do things," the libertarians and republicans no doubt said. Why are people allowed to build homes there without foolproof shelters under every house? At least they had an adequate warning system, but 24 still died and 200 got hurt.

Tornadoes are not like earthquakes in that they can be predicted well enough that you have 20 minutes to find shelter. A better and something that won't drive house prices here to California prices would be to build shelters for each block or so. As for the casualty levels, I think we should do better, let's put Millie catchers on cars so we can reduce the distracted Millie pedestrian casualty levels. I always have to watch dumb as rocks distracted Millies who amble across the street even though they have the red light.

"How many deaths will it take till he knows, that too many people have died?" The answer is blowin' in the wind. And how!

And on the front of cars I might add.

Originally Posted by Ragnarök_62

The May 3, 1999 tornado that struck pretty much the same area was bigger.

Much less damaging, and I don't know if it was bigger. According to news reports, this tornado was a rare, level 5 storm; the worst people have ever seen.

Tornadoes are not like earthquakes in that they can be predicted well enough that you have 20 minutes to find shelter. A better and something that won't drive house prices here to California prices would be to build shelters for each block or so. As for the casualty levels, I think we should do better, let's put Millie catchers on cars so we can reduce the distracted Millie pedestrian casualty levels. I always have to watch dumb as rocks distracted Millies who amble across the street even though they have the red light.

There's not the slightest excuse for not requiring homebuilders to include secure basements in their homes and public buildings. Of course the people in Republican Oklahoma probably won't. They didn't learn their lesson from the Dust Bowl either. According to Ken Burns, when the okies suffered their plight, they were quite ready to ask for federal help. Dorothea Lange was taking their picture, Woody Guthrie was singing their praises. They were suddenly all left-wing and socialist and all upset about the grapes of wrath where they settled in CA. No personal responsiblity meme then! But now you look at the Dust Bowl counties, and they are the most Republican in the country. They didn't learn shit. Self-responsibility-meme city!

And so their cousins a little to the East in tornado alley are going to suffer tornado after tornado until there too there is nothing left. They are going to be presented with the same lesson again and again until they learn that self-responsibility, denial of reality and hatred of government is going to get them nothing but their own death and destruction. It is not distracted Millies that are worth concern, but the deceived core Xers like the folks here, such as Prince, The Rani, Copperfield, Classic Xer, Galen, JDG, Justin et al, who will cling to their self-responsibility nonsense even after it hits them in the face, just as if they were the ones distracted while crossing a busy street.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

Much less damaging, and I don't know if it was bigger. According to news reports, this tornado was a rare, level 5 storm; the worst people have ever seen.

Incorrect again. The 1999 Moore tornado caused more damage and killed more people than Monday's tornado. You do realize that you can actually look this stuff up pretty easily these days right?

Originally Posted by Copperfield

Incorrect again. The 1999 Moore tornado caused more damage and killed more people than Monday's tornado. You do realize that you can actually look this stuff up pretty easily these days right?

You do realize that you are minimizing the issue of global warming and the failure to build shelters, don't you? You do realize that you are trying to save your failed Gen Xer personal-responsibility meme from facing up to its results, don't you?

(quote)
The Oklahoma Insurance Department says a preliminary estimate suggests the cost of damage from the tornado could be more than $2 billion.

The five ranking puts the tornado in the same class as the deadliest in U.S. history, which hit Joplin, Mo., in 2011, killing 158 and injuring hundreds more.
(/quote)

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/weather/2013/...#ixzz2UMFnTHtm

The webpage you referred me to said the damage from the 1999 twister was $1 billion, and that it fluctuated in and out of 5 ranking, although at its height it was faster.

At least someone has some sense out there in Oklahoma. From the same article:

The mayor of the Oklahoma City suburb that was devastated by a massive tornado Monday says he wants safe-room shelters built in all new homes.

Moore Mayor Glen Lewis, on Wednesday, said he will propose an ordinance in the next couple of days at the Moore City Council that would modify building codes to require the construction of reinforced shelters in every new home in the town of 56,000.

Lewis says he is confident he'll get the four votes needed on the six-member council. The measure could be in force within months.

Underground safe rooms are typically built below garages and can cost around $4,000.

Originally Posted by The Rani

P.S. Eric, I'm not taking the bait.

That's OK. I never miss a chance to knock the Gen Xer personal responsibility meme.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

You do realize that you are minimizing the issue of global warming and the failure to build shelters, don't you? You do realize that you are trying to save your failed Gen Xer personal-responsibility meme from facing up to its results, don't you?

(quote)
The Oklahoma Insurance Department says a preliminary estimate suggests the cost of damage from the tornado could be more than $2 billion.

The five ranking puts the tornado in the same class as the deadliest in U.S. history, which hit Joplin, Mo., in 2011, killing 158 and injuring hundreds more.
(/quote)

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/weather/2013/...#ixzz2UMFnTHtm

The webpage you referred me to said the damage from the 1999 twister was $1 billion, and that it fluctuated in and out of 5 ranking, although at its height it was faster.

At least someone has some sense out there in Oklahoma. From the same article:

The mayor of the Oklahoma City suburb that was devastated by a massive tornado Monday says he wants safe-room shelters built in all new homes.

Moore Mayor Glen Lewis, on Wednesday, said he will propose an ordinance in the next couple of days at the Moore City Council that would modify building codes to require the construction of reinforced shelters in every new home in the town of 56,000.

Lewis says he is confident he'll get the four votes needed on the six-member council. The measure could be in force within months.

Underground safe rooms are typically built below garages and can cost around $4,000.

Oh I'm a big fan of shelters. Additionally I'm a big fan of food, water and ammunition supplies, knowing and practicing evacuation routes, owning gear and clothing for all possible local weather patterns/seasons, having an intimate knowledge of local geography, having a back-up location/rally point, having the ability to move swiftly and quietly by vehicle or on foot over moderate to long distances, knowing how to evade, awareness of surroundings, knowing how to live off the land and having the ability to teach others how to do all of these things.

You were saying?

Originally Posted by Copperfield

Oh I'm a big fan of shelters. Additionally I'm a big fan of food, water and ammunition supplies, knowing and practicing evacuation routes, owning gear and clothing for all possible local weather patterns/seasons, having an intimate knowledge of local geography, having a back-up location/rally point, having the ability to move swiftly and quietly by vehicle or on foot over moderate to long distances, knowing how to evade, awareness of surroundings, knowing how to live off the land and having the ability to teach others how to do all of these things.

You were saying?

What good is all that for the people of Oklahoma and Missouri, etc., if the government does not require shelters, and therefore buildings are unsafe in the face of increasing climate change? The same goes for people who want to build in flood plains. Personal responsibility is not enough; people need the prodding and guidance and "teaching" of the law, or they will just do the easy and convenient thing or profit off of others by constructing unsafe buildings, whether in the USA or Bangladesh. That's what I was saying, and what you disagree with.

It's a culture, and cost thing, keeping adequate shelters limited where they are needed most. NPR just ran a piece on shelters being built in Joplin and Springfield, and the local school administrators can't get the public to pony up the 25% of the cost of new shelters. FEMA, that durn lib'l federal agency, will pay 75%. See the Governor of Texas turning down $100 billion in free federal cash for healthcare.

St. Louis generally has basements for homes, but even those are not proof against an EF-5. Two years ago or so, a tornado went right over Lambert Field, then proceeded to trash much of North County. The difference is that the local political culture would be committing suicide if it behaved as the red state legislators in Congress. The damage was dealt with as a natural disaster, not as a political opportunity.

Time to move north of the freeze line...

You can excuse Justin on that one. The Baltic basin has few tornadoes if any.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

You do realize that you are minimizing the issue of global warming and the failure to build shelters, don't you?

Global warming and shelters are 2 different issues.

Originally Posted by Eric

There's not the slightest excuse for not requiring home builders to include secure basements in their homes and public buildings. Of course the people in Republican Oklahoma probably won't.

The lead time for tornado warnings is 13 minutes. There is no need to tack on costly mandates when they're not needed and jack up house prices (LIKE CALI!!!!!!).

Please go read up on stuff before writing screed. Hopefully tornadoes 101 isn't above your head level.

They didn't learn their lesson from the Dust Bowl either. According to Ken Burns, when the okies suffered their plight, they were quite ready to ask for federal help.

What lessons were not learned from the dust bowl?
OMG! This right wing rag, NYT sez we did. How tacky of them to refute what you said.

Dorothea Lange was taking their picture, Woody Guthrie was singing their praises. They were suddenly all left-wing and socialist and all upset about the grapes of wrath where they settled in CA. No personal responsibility meme then! But now you look at the Dust Bowl counties, and they are the most Republican in the country. They didn't learn shit. Self-responsibility-meme city!

1. I fixed your spelling error on "responsibility". Perhaps you can get a decent web browser that will underline spelling errors and show some responsibility towards younger posters.
2. Sour grapes? OK that deserves a video.


Oh wonderful, we're getting some screed about politics.

Originally Posted by Eric

You do realize that you are trying to save your failed Gen Xer personal-responsibility meme from facing up to its results, don't you?

GenX bashing, cute.

(quote)
The Oklahoma Insurance Department says a preliminary estimate suggests the cost of damage from the tornado could be more than $2 billion.

The five ranking puts the tornado in the same class as the deadliest in U.S. history, which hit Joplin, Mo., in 2011, killing 158 and injuring hundreds more.
(/quote]

1. We get F-5's every year or so.
2. The more sprawl you get, the more likely something of value will get knocked down, and there's inflation.
3. The inflation adjusted cost of 1999 tornado is : $1,395,744,297.7
4. Useful website for comparing oranges to oranges. : http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/weather/2013/...#ixzz2UMFnTHtm

Tornadoes are pretty much like that. If you want a real eye opener, try hurricanes.

The webpage you referred me to said the damage from the 1999 twister was $1 billion, and that it fluctuated in and out of 5 ranking, although at its height it was faster.

Nothing new there either. You may want to check in with Vandal and get how atmospheric physics works.

At least someone has some sense out there in Oklahoma. From the same article:

The mayor of the Oklahoma City suburb that was devastated by a massive tornado Monday says he wants safe-room shelters built in all new homes.

Nice, and tack on $4000 a pop for each house. While were at it and since we're on global warming, let's also mandate solar panels, hail proof roofs (yes we get lots of hail here as well), R20 insulation, PCB free paint remediation. ( The paint we're using now has PCB's for certain hues), foundation piers since we have clay soil, and heat pumps only.

http://www.sciencenews.org/view/gene...int_isnt_green

Moore Mayor Glen Lewis, on Wednesday, said he will propose an ordinance in the next couple of days at the Moore City Council that would modify building codes to require the construction of reinforced shelters in every new home in the town of 56,000.

Lewis says he is confident he'll get the four votes needed on the six-member council. The measure could be in force within months.

Underground safe rooms are typically built below garages and can cost around $4,000.

Let people buy them if they want them. Nannycrats suck big.

Originally Posted by copperfield

Oh I'm a big fan of shelters. Additionally I'm a big fan of food, water and ammunition supplies, knowing and practicing evacuation routes, owning gear and clothing for all possible local weather patterns/seasons, having an intimate knowledge of local geography, having a back-up location/rally point, having the ability to move swiftly and quietly by vehicle or on foot over moderate to long distances, knowing how to evade, awareness of surroundings, knowing how to live off the land and having the ability to teach others how to do all of these things.

May I present the humble dandelion?

http://www.incrediblesmoothies.com/g...reen-smoothie/

I do apologize, but you'll have to scrounge some meat up for vitamin B-12 and go sun yourself for vitamin D.

Sorry, new rules apply wrt sun exposure.
http://health.yahoo.net/experts/skin...s-sun-exposure

Now, the good news is that the rules for limiting sun exposure didn't exist when I was a kid. My first family doc told my mom to get me OUT IN THE SUN. That was saying something since I was a towheaded blue eyed type toddler.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

What good is all that for the people of Oklahoma and Missouri, etc., if the government does not require shelters, and therefore buildings are unsafe in the face of increasing climate change? The same goes for people who want to build in flood plains. Personal responsibility is not enough; people need the prodding and guidance and "teaching" of the law, or they will just do the easy and convenient thing or profit off of others by constructing unsafe buildings, whether in the USA or Bangladesh. That's what I was saying, and what you disagree with.

Technically the best way to avoid the very small chance of being hit by a tornado is to not live in an area called tornado alley. But life you see, is an incredibly risky venture and as the new saying goes, "On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero." Personal safety is a personal responsibility. I am content enough to say that I would not live in a home in tornado alley without a storm shelter. Others living there may desire more or less risk in their life than I would. I have no problem with either choice.

Originally Posted by Ragnarök_62

May I present the humble dandelion?

http://www.incrediblesmoothies.com/g...reen-smoothie/

I do apologize, but you'll have to scrounge some meat up for vitamin B-12 and go sun yourself for vitamin D.

Sorry, new rules apply wrt sun exposure.
http://health.yahoo.net/experts/skin...s-sun-exposure

Now, the good news is that the rules for limiting sun exposure didn't exist when I was a kid. My first family doc told my mom to get me OUT IN THE SUN. That was saying something since I was a towheaded blue eyed type toddler.

Warning: Dandelions taste like ass. Meat here is easy to come by and I have enough firepower to eat well off everything from the lowly squirrel all the way up to the ornery swamp cow (moose). I noticed however that you forgot vitamin C. For short-term displacements you can live with the deficiency however if one finds themselves in a situation that calls for a longer period without grocery store nutrition available, a vitamin C deficiency can be a serious issue. May I recommend the common pine tree as an effective solution. Some of them are poisonous though so check your local varieties to be sure.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

That's OK. I never miss a chance to knock the Gen Xer personal responsibility meme.

It seems more likely that she has better things to do than argue with a moron.

Originally Posted by Copperfield

Warning: Dandelions taste like ass.

Just a tad bitter. Nothing a little Italian salad dressing can't fix. I did try some for lunch after reading that article.
Oh, they do have the vitamin C as well.

Bitter:

Originally Posted by fabulous snptips addon

rs10246939 is one of three SNPs that form the main haplotypes behind the ability to perceive as bitter the taste of the compound phenylthiocarbamide (PTC) and similar molecules in foods (like cabbage and raw broccoli) or drinks (like coffee and dark beers). The rs10246939(C) allele, in the orientation shown in dbSNP, is the 'tasting' allele, and it is dominant to the 'non-tasting' allele rs10246939(T), so having one copy is enough to have the bitter tasting ability. If you are a 'taster', you're also likely to carry at least one rs713598(G) and one rs1726866(C) allele since, along with rs10246939(C), these three SNPs form the most common tasting haplotype. If you lack these alleles, you're quite likely (~80%) to be a non-taster of bitterness, meaning that foods that may taste bitter to oth...

Simple translation. I don't taste bitter that well. We did the PTC test in college biology. I can't taste that stuff. Other students about barfed from it.

Meat here is easy to come by and I have enough firepower to eat well off everything from the lowly squirrel all the way up to the ornery swamp cow (moose). I noticed however that you forgot vitamin C. For short-term displacements you can live with the deficiency however if one finds themselves in a situation that calls for a longer period without grocery store nutrition available, a vitamin C deficiency can be a serious issue. May I recommend the common pine tree as an effective solution. Some of them are poisonous though so check your local varieties to be sure.

What part of the tree?

Originally Posted by famous commercial

Perhaps you remember, long ago, a television commercial for Grape Nuts Cereal
that started with Euell Gibbons asking earnestly “Did you know you could eat a pine
tree?” He asked the wrong question. What Gibbons should have asked was “Did you
know you can eat pine seeds?” The needles of pine trees are certainly not edible.

Pine trees, etc.


Warning to Eric. Do not play this, it has heavy metal background music.

Back to tornado alley -- I certainly think it is within the place of municipal and state governments to require that schools have below-level shelter areas, no?

Originally Posted by Ragnarök_62

What part of the tree?

Pine needles. Use them to make tea.

Originally Posted by The Wonkette

Back to tornado alley -- I certainly think it is within the place of municipal and state governments to require that schools have below-level shelter areas, no?

If they're going to be building them, they sure as hell need to be held liable for the consequences of building them badly. I think that's totally noncontroversial.

Originally Posted by The Wonkette

Back to tornado alley -- I certainly think it is within the place of municipal and state governments to require that schools have below-level shelter areas, no?

Not shelters, but I just remembered that we did have designated fallout shelters. The idea of building bunkers would make far more sense. I'm also sure we'd get a lot more *political traction with that meme. Each neighborhood would also have bunkers, not "shelters". The difference between a bunker and a shelter is bunkers would be larger so folks can store food, ammo, water,etc. Since bunkers are multi use and flexible, they're far better. If N. Korea eventually gets long range ICBM's, no problem, we have our bunkers.

The idea of the whole state of Oklahoma going prepper gives me a warm fuzzy feeling and I'd support it whole heartedly .So, a state mandated bunker program with a spec that said bunkers be drone proof/fallout ready is just perfect.

*I think said program could even be enacted by plebiscite. We have a referendum process here to do that. I'd also love the irony. Schools would get sheltered via full range tea party support of the referendum. Eric and the Tea Party would agree on something.

EDIT
Bunkers are infrastructure. Infrastructure = jobs program. Eric should also support the Rag's bunker building project just for that reason alone.

Schools. Schools are generally in neighborhoods. We'd just build larger bunkers for the school proper and adjacent houses. I'd also tack on a bit of extra space for folks who may wind up trapped near by. That would usually be a parent or other family member. They could also be designated canning areas, etc.

Originally Posted by Ragnarök_62

Global warming and shelters are 2 different issues.

Not at all. You know that; it should be obvious to all, of course. No need to be more specific; that would be talking down. But your idea of bunkers as more appealing to the tea party too is interesting. It could satisfy their need for increasing protection from the bad weather that they themselves are causing, and at the same time help prepare them for the secession and civil war that they want so they don't have to pay taxes for such protection! Very good Rags.

The lead time for tornado warnings is 13 minutes. There is no need to tack on costly mandates when they're not needed and jack up house prices (LIKE CALI!!!!!!).

Let people buy them if they want them. Nannycrats suck big.

Go Nannycrats! 13 minutes is very little lead time to get yourselves and all your valuable items down below, but that's something at least. But maybe we do need a new political party, since Americans are so (fill in the blank) that they need some kind of nanny to go into the polls with them when they vote; they so suck at that simple task.

Originally Posted by Copperfield

Technically the best way to avoid the very small chance of being hit by a tornado is to not live in an area called tornado alley. But life you see, is an incredibly risky venture and as the new saying goes, "On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero." Personal safety is a personal responsibility. I am content enough to say that I would not live in a home in tornado alley without a storm shelter. Others living there may desire more or less risk in their life than I would. I have no problem with either choice.

What was it, 13,000 homes? It's not such a "very small chance" anymore. It's practically routine! Now that we have global warming, thanks to you guys, making life unnecessarily risky just because you guys don't want any taxes or rules, builders should be required to make homes that are safe from your weather. Personal responsibility meme, go fly a kite in a tornado! Social responsibility is what we need, big time! What we need is more protection from the personal responsibility meme.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

What was it, 13,000 homes? It's not such a "very small chance" anymore. It's practically routine! Now that we have global warming, thanks to you guys, making life unnecessarily risky just because you guys don't want any taxes or rules, builders should be required to make homes that are safe from your weather. Personal responsibility meme, go fly a kite in a tornado! Social responsibility is what we need, big time! What we need is more protection from the personal responsibility meme.

The figure of 13,000 includes homes both damaged and destroyed. Even if we assume all 13,000 homes were completely destroyed that means that only 1 in 10,000 homes in the United States (132 million homes according to the last census) were destroyed during this particular tornado (itself very rare). That's 0.0001%. According to the total tornado statistics some 50,000 homes are destroyed by tornados each year which only brings the chance of a given home being destroyed to 0.0026% per year. That's incredibly remote.

Of course homes built in tornado alley have a slightly higher risk of being hit by a tornado than homes built in, say, New England or the Pacific North West. They do call it tornado alley for a reason. Tornados themselves are a function of the unique geography of the United States. The Rocky and Appalachian mountains ranges on either side of the plains functionally trap and funnel cold air from the arctic and warm air from the tropics, causing it to crash together in the middle of the country creating some very beautiful storms which simply cannot be described. I can recall witnessing super cells in Nebraska where there was so much lightning that night literally turned to day. Absolutely magnificent.

3 out of 4 tornados that occur on earth are generated in the Great Plains. This destructive weather isn’t a bad thing either. In fact, the severe weather of the plains is one of the forces that have created such fertile land there.

Originally Posted by Eric the Green

Not at all. You know that; it should be obvious to all, of course. No need to be more specific;

How are tornadoes linked to global warming? Citation needed/requested.

that would be talking down.

The stuff in a prior post that I labeled "screed" came across as "talking down".

But your idea of bunkers as more appealing to the tea party too is interesting. It could satisfy their need for increasing protection from the bad weather that they themselves are causing, and at the same time help prepare them for the secession and civil war that they want

They (Tea Party) are causing global warming? This is hyper simplistic.
1. China? They're #1 now. No TP link there.
2. India? Catching up fast.
3. Methane sources. Well, I do have a creative idea for 1 methane source: cows. Cows fart out methane. Since methane is a much more efficient green house gas than CO2, let's burn cow farts. Technology: Connect rubber hoses to cow asses and pipe the methane off to the nearest wellhead. Stuff like my stove would burn cow fart derived methane. The rubber hose would have a "poop shoot" to drop of the droppings!

so they don't have to pay taxes for such protection! Very good Rags.

TYVM. Of utmost service. The revenue source of bunkers, that would be taxes.

The plebiscite would determine the type of tax to fund this. Bunkers are not free. I don't see the tax issue being a problem since I expect wild endorsement of the proposal.

Go Nannycrats! 13 minutes is very little lead time to get yourselves and all your valuable items down below, but that's something at least.

Ever been in a tornado? I have. We left straight away to our neighbor's shelter. Normally, folks don't take stuff with them except perhaps pets. There ain't enough room to bring much. This was in 1965 when tornado forecasting wasn't near as good as today.
Green clouds make such that even toddlers remember tornado events.

But maybe we do need a new political party, since Americans are so (fill in the blank) that they need some kind of nanny to go into the polls with them when they vote; they so suck at that simple task.

Oooh. An opinion. Yeah, ok. Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one and most of them reek.

BIG EDIT

Originally Posted by Eric the ©©®ӂᴥ♠♣♥♦☺

ﭺWhat was it, 13,000 homes? It's not such a "very small chance" anymore. It's practically routine! Now that we have global warming, thanks to you guys, making life unnecessarily risky just because you guys don't want any taxes or rules, builders should be required to make homes that are safe from your weather. Personal responsibility meme, go fly a kite in a tornado! Social responsibility is what we need, big time! What we need is more protection from the personal responsibility meme.

.....screed. Bunkers man.

1. Issue wrt shelters = fixed
2. "go fly a kite in tornado!" Hmmm.... needs a video.




Can't resist this image either.

I grew up three blocks from such a bunker. I was one of the few who knew how to get in During the early sixties, there was little or no warning time to make it there. And, only eight miles from multiple primary targets, little point.

Hurricane Andrew went right over one of my old bunkers at Homestead, and trashed it.

Mass shelter works after the disaster, a rally point as it were. Individual shelters can protect, up to a point. Food, water, sanitation need to be maintained. The large shelters work better if given reaction time.

We have large numbers of persons, in suburban/exurban areas like Moore, that are wide open. These areas have grown massively in the last forty years, with little or no individual preparation. No matter what your position on climate change is, these levels of disasters are now more likely due to sprawl. The same goes for coastal areas, and seismic zones. At a time when the economy needs stimulus, the options are obvious. Politics be damned.

if Yellowstone goes, all bets are off. Australia, anybody?

Originally Posted by Ragnarök_62

How are tornadoes linked to global warming? Citation needed/requested.

All severe weather today is increasing due to global warming. Sources? every scientist who has studied the matter. In the big picture, global warming = severe weather. It is safer to prepare.

Some say the factor of wind shear may decrease, which may reduce one factor in tornadoes, even though there are more thunderstorms.

"What we find in the models," Trapp says, "is there's actually an increase in the product. The decrease in wind shear is more than compensated [for] by the increase in energy. This tells us that the number of days that support severe thunderstorms generically should increase."

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...lobal-warming/

They (Tea Party) are causing global warming? This is hyper simplistic.

Not at all. Look at the voting records of these folk. They are totally against any conservation or energy conversion. They have been for 32 years or more, and are blocking most action. Case closed. They are the #1 causes of global warming.

3. Methane sources. Well, I do have a creative idea for 1 methane source: cows. Cows fart out methane. Since methane is a much more efficient green house gas than CO2, let's burn cow farts. Technology: Connect rubber hoses to cow asses and pipe the methane off to the nearest wellhead. Stuff like my stove would burn cow fart derived methane. The rubber hose would have a "poop shoot" to drop of the droppings!

We depend too much on cows for food. If we eat less meat and dairy, we won't need so many cows and their methane.

Ever been in a tornado? I have. We left straight away to our neighbor's shelter. Normally, folks don't take stuff with them except perhaps pets. There ain't enough room to bring much. This was in 1965 when tornado forecasting wasn't near as good as today.

Yes, we have more warning now. Residents should have the ability to collect what they can and take it down with them. Why should tornadoes be allowed to take everything away that people own?

Originally Posted by Bad Dog

if Yellowstone goes, all bets are off. Australia, anybody?

Everyone is pretty much equally fucked when Yellowstone goes off, Australia included. It won't be the end of the world but it will be the end of the world as we know it. That said, Yellowstone is the other primary cause of the fertility of the great plains.