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Thread: Iran - Page 10







Post#226 at 02-11-2012 11:05 PM by JDFP [at Knoxville, TN. joined Jul 2010 #posts 1,200]
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My older brother is a Company Commander in the U.S. Army, he served a tour in Afghanistan and two tours in Iraq (his second deployment for 16 months). I don't want a war with Iran to happen - mainly, as selfish as it may seem, I fear for his safety. But, I also fear for the safety of all our troops.

A war with Iran won't be like the "Nintendo War" with Iraq. It'll be many years and will cost thousands of lives. It will be tragic and disastrous. And the ultimate victim will be the civilians in Iran who just try to get by day by day in their lives much like most of us do. I really fear it's not a matter if "if" but "when" though. My hope is that Israel will strike first though and with having the most competent intelligence agency in the world, bar none (the Mossad) they will be able to take out the majority of the heavy artillery and weaponry in Iran. That way when we "bring the rain" it won't be as bad for our American troops. And my God - when ground forces go in - it'll be an absolutely horrible thing for all concerned.

On the bright side, if there is one to be considered, at least troops will not be going into this situation green. After years of Afghanistan and Iraq we have war-hardened and prepared troops who are ready for the majority of what will ensue. I just hope that the government gives to the military the personnel and capability to do what is absolutely necessary for this upcoming conflict to not last as long as it could or be as disastrous as it possibly could be.

I don't want it to happen - but just as it was when I was working as a store manager for Blockbuster several years ago the writing was on the wall that it was all going to come crashing down soon (of course, with that company knowing I was more competent than the majority of my "leaders" did not help matters) and it just makes me ill to consider it all.

j.p.

"And did you get what you wanted from this life, even so? I did. And what did you want? To call myself beloved, to feel myself beloved on the earth.‎" -- Raymond Carver


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page of good prose remains invincible." -- John Cheever










Post#227 at 02-11-2012 11:21 PM by radind [at Alabama joined Sep 2009 #posts 1,595]
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Quote Originally Posted by TimWalker View Post
A newspaper article mentioned Romney's anti-Iran rhetoric. If elected, could he emulate Nixon and realign the USA with Iran? The USA would get continued access to Persian Gulf oil; the Iranian regime would be spared a war.
Regardless of who is President, it takes two to realign.







Post#228 at 02-12-2012 10:28 AM by '58 Flat [at Hardhat From Central Jersey joined Jul 2001 #posts 3,300]
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Quote Originally Posted by radind View Post
Regardless of who is President, it takes two to realign.

As Ronald Reagan and Iran did - with Iran-Contra?
But maybe if the putative Robin Hoods stopped trying to take from law-abiding citizens and give to criminals, take from men and give to women, take from believers and give to anti-believers, take from citizens and give to "undocumented" immigrants, and take from heterosexuals and give to homosexuals, they might have a lot more success in taking from the rich and giving to everyone else.

Don't blame me - I'm a Baby Buster!







Post#229 at 02-24-2012 06:39 PM by katsung47 [at joined Jan 2011 #posts 289]
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704. Iran war (2) (1/28/2011)

Be noticed that on 1/10, Treasury Secretary Geithner visited China. I allege it was to confirm the secret deal. Next day, there was such a news:

Harper to visit China, seeking higher oil sales
By David Ljunggren | Reuters – Wed, Jan 11, 2012


OTTAWA (Reuters) - Prime Minister Stephen Harper plans to visit China next month as his government looks to open new markets for oil sands crude in the wake of Washington's decision to delay approval of a major pipeline from Alberta to Texas.
After winning power in 2006, Harper's Conservatives initially took a cool line with China and cited what they described as Beijing's poor human rights record.

http://news.yahoo.com/harper-visit-c...202731193.html

For the war on Iran, puppet Canada government ignores Beijing's poor human rights, now has a warm line to satisfy China's great appetite on oil.

On Jan. 18, news reported that "Obama rejects oil pipeline from Canada, triggering loud controversy". Of course, it is not for the consideration of environment as he said. It is part of the secret deal for Iran war.

All these events: Geithner's China visit, Harper's plan to visit China for oil export to China, Obama's reject of the oil pipeline from Canada, Chinese Premier Wen's visit to Gulf and new deals with these oil countries, were done within ten days - from Jan.10 to Jan. 18. The technical details must have been prepared in advance. That plan should have started from last November.

My last clear warning for Iran war date was October. see "691. October 21 plot (11/1/2011)". It signals with Harold Camping's World End Day prediction and FBI's case of "Iran plans to assassinate Saudi ambassador in US soil".

Since November, they were preparing this big one - bribe China. Part of this plot is NDAA. It was proposed in late November. When Obama signed it into law on 12/31, I wrote on 1/2, "700. National Defense Authorization Act (1/2/2012)". On point 5, I said,

"5. War on Iran is their major goal. With great possibility, there will be false flag nuclear attacks on US cities to justify the Iran war. Most people realize the truth of the 911 attack. This law is created to deal with the people who won’t believe this government anymore when such “terror attack” happens again. "

I would say my observation was very accurate. One week later, we saw all these events relate to Iran war.







Post#230 at 02-24-2012 07:19 PM by radind [at Alabama joined Sep 2009 #posts 1,595]
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Quote Originally Posted by '58 Flat View Post
As Ronald Reagan and Iran did - with Iran-Contra?
No. I had in mind a serious effort by both parties to realign for mutual interests. So far, I have not seen any evidence of Iran's interest in anything but threats.







Post#231 at 03-01-2012 04:40 PM by pbrower2a [at "Michigrim" joined May 2005 #posts 15,014]
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Congress condemns Iran for sentencing Christian pastor to death

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/03...#ixzz1ntqhgqza


Congress unanimously approved a new resolution condemning the Iranian government for sentencing to death a Christian pastor accused of renouncing Islam.

Youcef Nadarkhani's sentence has been affirmed at the highest levels of Iran's legal system and could be carried out at anytime, according to his supporters. The sentence shows that Tehran has again "failed to uphold its obligations to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights," reads House Resolution 556.

The resolution, drafted by Pennsylvania Republican Joseph Pitts, calls for Iran to immediately exonerate and unconditionally release Nadarkhani as well as any other people who are being held or charged for religious or political beliefs.

"In Iran today, Pastor Youcef Nadharkani is in a high security prison wondering whether he will be executed for his faith," Pitts told FoxNews.com. "The government of Iran should abide by the agreements they have signed at the United Nations, which call for religious freedom. The House is asking the highest authorities in Iran to let Pastor Youcef return to his family and worship in peace."

Jordan Sekulow, executive director of the American Center for Law and Justice, said the lawmakers' stand sends a powerful message.

"The truly bipartisan support in the House to stand up for Pastor Youcef and demand his release is extraordinary," Sekulow said in a released statement. "Iran is violating international law with its detention and promised execution of Pastor Youcef. We're grateful that so many members of Congress -- from different political and religious backgrounds -- understand the importance of standing up for religious freedom, for human rights."

Nadarkhani, who also held house church services in Iran, was facing execution after being convicted of apostasy in November 2010, but appealed his conviction all the way up to the Iranian Supreme Court. He refused to renounce his Christianity and was sentenced to death.

Amid widespread condemnation, the Iranian court introduced new charges of rape and extortion, charges Nadarkhani's supporters say are false and trumped up merely to justify his execution.



Nadarkhani has been detained for nearly two and a half years

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/03...#ixzz1ntqa8Ndf
The greatest evil is not now done in those sordid "dens of crime" (or) even in concentration camps and labour camps. In those we see its final result. But it is conceived and ordered... in clean, carpeted, warmed and well-lighted offices, by (those) who do not need to raise their voices. Hence, naturally enough, my symbol for Hell is something like the bureaucracy of a police state or the office of a thoroughly nasty business concern."


― C.S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters







Post#232 at 03-01-2012 04:56 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#233 at 03-02-2012 06:18 PM by disgruntledxer [at Seattle, WA joined Sep 2010 #posts 674]
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I am starting to believe that Iran is being hyped so the nation can focus on an enemy that is not the other political side. I am a firm believer that the government uses S-H to its own ends.
Initially, the questions I ask when reviewing any saeculur event: What did the decision makers know about the cyclical time, when did they know it, and how did they act on that knowledge? Then I can ask the question, "what was their purpose?" I take extra special notice when reviewing events before Generations was released by Strauss-Howe.







Post#234 at 03-04-2012 02:02 AM by Chas'88 [at In between Pennsylvania & Pennsyltucky joined Nov 2008 #posts 9,432]
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post
Hopefully we won't have to sing this song yet again...

~Chas'88
"There have always been people who say: "The war will be over someday." I say there's no guarantee the war will ever be over. Naturally a brief intermission is conceivable. Maybe the war needs a breather, a war can even break its neck, so to speak. But the kings and emperors, not to mention the pope, will always come to its help in adversity. ON the whole, I'd say this war has very little to worry about, it'll live to a ripe old age."







Post#235 at 03-04-2012 02:18 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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Quote Originally Posted by Chas'88 View Post
Hopefully we won't have to sing this song yet again...

~Chas'88
It appears that it is a strong possibility that we will once again sing that song.

"Let no day pass without headbutting an ignorant politician, and kissing a sceptical historian."

We are fighting Islamism from ignorance, as we did the cold war

The west wasted trillions in needless conflict with the USSR. Now we are being brainwashed into confrontation with Iran



The cold war consumed trillions of dollars. Hundreds of thousands died in surrogate wars around the globe. The opportunity cost in poverty and disease, in growth foregone and democracy postponed, was awesome. The embattlement of eastern Europe, like that of today's Islamist states, retarded its passage into economic and political maturity. The cold war was not a war of good against evil. It was ignorance so pernicious as to question "the integrity and basic intelligence" of those democratic institutions persuaded that they were under existential threat.

Where Alexander goes for broke is in showing how this ignorance is ongoing. With the end of the cold war – and the west's later inept handling of Russia – the west's craving for a necessary enemy has revived. For a decade after 1990, defence chiefs resorted to genocidal autocrats, drug lords and Balkan separatists to maintain their budgets, which duly dwindled. Then came 9/11 and a "clash of civilisations". Bush and Blair won elections. Bankers lent money to generals, and the military-industrial complex refloated on an ocean of myth and mendacity.

The brainwashing was ubiquitous. No book, no argument, no evidence could dissuade any British cabinet from the belief that only a giant defensive armoury stood between it and a communist takeover, and now stands against an Islamist Armageddon. Hence the need to keep nuclear-armed submarines at sea, somehow to deter an unnamed "terrorist state". Likewise, five of the original six Republican candidates for US president recently called for war with Iran for "posing a threat to the American people". What threat?
I believe Alexander is right to seek explanation not in the realpolitik of international relations, but in the motives of democratic leaders.

America's belief in itself as the "greatest superpower the world has ever seen" led Lyndon B Johnson to impotent fury at being thrashed by "a raggedy-ass little country" – Vietnam. It led Washington lobbyists to protect defence spending, as Truman was advised, by "scaring the hell out of the American people". Today, a similar self-delusion leads Washington and London to claim the right to drop bombs on anyone they find "unacceptable".
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...=FBCNETTXT9038
Last edited by Deb C; 03-04-2012 at 02:23 PM.
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#236 at 03-04-2012 09:46 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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Some optimistic news!

Israel 'not rushing into Iran war'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/iran...srael-iran-war
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#237 at 03-04-2012 11:17 PM by Chas'88 [at In between Pennsylvania & Pennsyltucky joined Nov 2008 #posts 9,432]
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post
Some optimistic news!

Israel 'not rushing into Iran war'

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/iran...srael-iran-war
Maybe they heard this song. Enjoy the parody.

~Chas'88
"There have always been people who say: "The war will be over someday." I say there's no guarantee the war will ever be over. Naturally a brief intermission is conceivable. Maybe the war needs a breather, a war can even break its neck, so to speak. But the kings and emperors, not to mention the pope, will always come to its help in adversity. ON the whole, I'd say this war has very little to worry about, it'll live to a ripe old age."







Post#238 at 03-05-2012 02:55 PM by JDG 66 [at joined Aug 2010 #posts 2,106]
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Quote Originally Posted by pbrower2a View Post
Congress condemns Iran for sentencing Christian pastor to death

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/03...#ixzz1ntqhgqza
-Oh, come on, PBR. He's a Christian proselytizer. Obviously, he has it coming.

Anyway:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newswee...lim-world.html

...So let us please get our priorities straight. Yes, Western governments should protect Muslim minorities from intolerance. And of course we should ensure that they can worship, live, and work freely and without fear. It is the protection of the freedom of conscience and speech that distinguishes free societies from unfree ones. But we also need to keep perspective about the scale and severity of intolerance. Cartoons, films, and writings are one thing; knives, guns, and grenades are something else entirely...

Instead of falling for overblown tales of Western Islamophobia, let’s take a real stand against the Christophobia infecting the Muslim world. Tolerance is for everyone—except the intolerant.







Post#239 at 03-05-2012 07:43 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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Ex-Generals, Intelligence Officials to Obama: No War of Choice With Iran

Eight former high-ranking military, intelligence and State Department officials took out an ad in the Washington Post today urging President Obama to stand fast against political and lobbying pressure to attack Iran over claims it is trying to develop nuclear weapons.

Military.com reports:

"There is a national reflex on the conservative part [of the] political spectrum to reach for the military option first and others second," said retired Army Maj. Gen. Paul Eaton, commander of the Coalition Military Assistance Training Team in Iraq from 2003 to 2004, when he developed and oversaw the training of the Iraqi military and security forces. [...]

The advertisement, which carries the headline "Mr. President: Say No to a War of Choice with Iran," is sponsored by the National Iranian American Council, a non-partisan, non-profit organization headquartered in Washington.

Though NIAC does not support the Iranian government it favors diplomacy over war in dealing with it, according to its website.

"NIAC opposes a U.S.-Iran war because it would be detrimental to U.S. national interest and likely prolong the reign of the current Iranian government," the group states.


http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/03/05-4

"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#240 at 03-05-2012 09:13 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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World Reacts to Obama's Security Pledge to Israel


President Obama's pledge that the United States "will always have Israel's back" and will attack Iran if it develops a nuclear weapon reverberated across the world Monday. His first remarks occurred during a Sunday conference hosted by the pro-Israel group American Israel Public Affairs Committee and his second remarks took place during a meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Here are the bits of commentary coming from countries around the world:

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/globa...-israel/49516/


"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#241 at 03-06-2012 03:42 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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Iran to allow IAEA to visit Parchin military site



http://www.jpost.com/Headlines/Article.aspx?id=260647
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#242 at 03-06-2012 05:47 PM by playwrite [at NYC joined Jul 2005 #posts 10,443]
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post

World Reacts to Obama's Security Pledge to Israel


President Obama's pledge that the United States "will always have Israel's back" and will attack Iran if it develops a nuclear weapon reverberated across the world Monday. His first remarks occurred during a Sunday conference hosted by the pro-Israel group American Israel Public Affairs Committee and his second remarks took place during a meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Here are the bits of commentary coming from countries around the world:

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/globa...-israel/49516/


Debs, I think you're not quite seeing the whole picture. The Israelis war hawks and their allies here in the US had a whole string of talking heads on every cable news show last night and this morning. They make Rumsfeld and Cheney look like 1960s peace protestors. My sources tell me that they are all over Capitol Hill yesterday and today drumming up support and pressure on Obama. They are clearly doing the same with the GOP candidates’ campaigns and editorial boards in every major metro area.

It is clear to just about anyone that they are ready to go to war, with at best, a somewhat limited surgical strike. The ONLY thing that is holding them back right now is Obama.
"The Devil enters the prompter's box and the play is ready to start" - R. Service

“It’s not tax money. The banks have accounts with the Fed … so, to lend to a bank, we simply use the computer to mark up the size of the account that they have with the Fed. It’s much more akin to printing money.” - B.Bernanke


"Keep your filthy hands off my guns while I decide what you can & can't do with your uterus" - Sarah Silverman

If you meet a magic pony on the road, kill it. - Playwrite







Post#243 at 03-06-2012 06:07 PM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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Quote Originally Posted by playwrite View Post
Debs, I think you're not quite seeing the whole picture. The Israelis war hawks and their allies here in the US had a whole string of talking heads on every cable news show last night and this morning. They make Rumsfeld and Cheney look like 1960s peace protestors. My sources tell me that they are all over Capitol Hill yesterday and today drumming up support and pressure on Obama. They are clearly doing the same with the GOP candidates’ campaigns and editorial boards in every major metro area.

It is clear to just about anyone that they are ready to go to war, with at best, a somewhat limited surgical strike. The ONLY thing that is holding them back right now is Obama.
I do see enough to understand that if Israel strikes Iran, the U.S. will be pulled into the mix. Even if the strikes are limited, as you indicate, it will fuel retaliation. Any violence toward Iran will light a powder keg.

Obama has declared his loyalty to Israel, knowing that they are hell bent on attacking Iran. That kind of declaration will put us smack in the middle of a volatile situation.
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#244 at 03-07-2012 12:38 AM by playwrite [at NYC joined Jul 2005 #posts 10,443]
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post
I do see enough to understand that if Israel strikes Iran, the U.S. will be pulled into the mix. Even if the strikes are limited, as you indicate, it will fuel retaliation. Any violence toward Iran will light a powder keg.

Obama has declared his loyalty to Israel, knowing that they are hell bent on attacking Iran. That kind of declaration will put us smack in the middle of a volatile situation.
Yep, once Israel goes in, we're along for the ride. Doesn't matter who's the Prez. And yea, I know about Ron Paul; it's one of the reasons he'll never come close to being Prez.

If the link is ever to be broken, it's going to take something like this.

If it happens, it will be a matter of degree - how big Israel goes, how big the Iranians respond. Hopefully, it will all be limited.

I'm not a proponent. I'm a realist.

My biggest concern, mostly because I see it as a high likelihood once it gets started, is an attempted US blockade of Iran's shipping. That really seems to be what the Israel's are angling for. They do a a surgical strike that pushes the Iranian program back without all out war and they take to heat with Hezbollah and Hamas raining down rockets on Tel Aviv but the Iranians backing down with any direct big response.

The Israel's restrain themselves to a surgical strike based on an agreement for "real sanctions" i.e. a naval blockade. It will be sold both by the need to protect the oil shipping lanes and that it will cause a regime change in Iran.

The wild card it this, however, will be whether either or both the Chinese and the Russians try to run the blockade. It's hard to see them not, it's hard to imagine the consequences.

To blame this on Obama is like praising Reagan for bringing down the Soviet Union single-handedly. Neither makes any sense if one knows the history. The history does make clear the little degree of freedom this or any other American President has - as much as we would like to believe otherwise.
"The Devil enters the prompter's box and the play is ready to start" - R. Service

“It’s not tax money. The banks have accounts with the Fed … so, to lend to a bank, we simply use the computer to mark up the size of the account that they have with the Fed. It’s much more akin to printing money.” - B.Bernanke


"Keep your filthy hands off my guns while I decide what you can & can't do with your uterus" - Sarah Silverman

If you meet a magic pony on the road, kill it. - Playwrite







Post#245 at 03-07-2012 11:07 AM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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Quote Originally Posted by playwrite View Post
To blame this on Obama is like praising Reagan for bringing down the Soviet Union single-handedly. Neither makes any sense if one knows the history. The history does make clear the little degree of freedom this or any other American President has - as much as we would like to believe otherwise.
I'm not blaming Obama. The situation is multifaceted and complicated. On the other hand, it doesn't make sense knowing that Israel is hell bent on attacking Iran, then selling them the weapons to do it. Netanyahu is now asking us to supply them with bunker busters.
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#246 at 03-07-2012 11:41 AM by playwrite [at NYC joined Jul 2005 #posts 10,443]
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post
I'm not blaming Obama. The situation is multifaceted and complicated. On the other hand, it doesn't make sense knowing that Israel is hell bent on attacking Iran, then selling them the weapons to do it. Netanyahu is now asking us to supply them with bunker busters.
I have some hope, but not much -

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/07/wo...exprod=myyahoo

Obama Scolds G.O.P. Critics of Iran Policy

WASHINGTON — President Obama on Tuesday forcefully rebuked Republicans on the presidential campaign trail and in Congress for “beating the drums of war” in criticizing his efforts to find a diplomatic solution to the crisis over Iran’s nuclear program, underscoring how squarely the national security issue had entered the election-year debate.

Mr. Obama’s comments, in which he suggested without naming Iraq that the United States had only recently gone to war “wrapped up in politics,” came in a televised news conference. The White House scheduled it on a day when leading Republicans were addressing an influential pro-Israel lobbying group, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, known as Aipac, at its annual conference.

There, the two leading Republican presidential candidates, Rick Santorum and Mitt Romney, assailed Mr. Obama’s foreign policy as ineffective and weak in their appeals to the group. The Senate Republican leader, Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, called for Congress to authorize the use of force against Iran.

The president was withering in his retort. “Those folks don’t have a lot of responsibilities,” Mr. Obama said. “They’re not commander in chief. When I see the casualness with which some of these folks talk about war, I’m reminded of the costs involved in war” — for those who go into combat, for national security and for the economy. “This is not a game,” he added. “And there’s nothing casual about it.”

“If some of these folks think that it’s time to launch a war, they should say so, and they should explain to the American people exactly why they would do that and what the consequences would be,” he said.


While the debate over Iran is unlikely to overshadow the economy as the predominant election issue, the heated back-and-forth this week — and the international tension over suspicions that Iran may seek to build nuclear weapons — ensure that it is now a part of the presidential contest.

The spark was the Aipac meeting, where members of both parties sought to show their support for Israel, especially against the potential threat of a nuclear-armed Iran. Mr. Obama spoke on Sunday, and Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel addressed the conference on Monday night after meeting earlier with Mr. Obama at the White House. The president, in his speech to Aipac, said military force was one option on the table for dealing with Iran. At the White House, Mr. Netanyahu told Mr. Obama that he had not made a decision on an Israeli strike, officials said, though he expressed deep skepticism that the president’s strategy of diplomatic and economic sanctions would force Iran to change course.

In his speech to Aipac, Mr. Santorum, a former Pennsylvania senator, accused Mr. Obama of allowing Iran “another appeasement, another delay, another opportunity for them to go forward while we talk.” When he addressed the group, Mr. Romney, a former Massachusetts governor, said, “The only thing respected by thugs and tyrants is our resolve, backed by our power and our readiness to use it.”

For a president who inherited wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and has spent three years trying to wind them down, the talk of war plainly rankled. Mr. Obama’s early opposition to the Bush administration’s war against Iraq helped him to win the Democratic presidential nomination in 2008 over Hillary Rodham Clinton, who had voted to authorize force against Iraq as a senator, and he seemed to recall the period in drawing parallels to the current debate on Iran.

Citing the costs in lives lost or forever changed at his news conference, Mr. Obama said: “Sometimes we bear that cost, but we think it through. We don’t play politics with it. When we have in the past — when we haven’t thought it through and it gets wrapped up in politics — we make mistakes. And typically it’s not the folks who are popping off who pay the price.”

The politics aside, Mr. Obama struck a markedly more circumspect note on Iran a day after he expressed solidarity with Mr. Netanyahu. He reiterated at the news conference the need for time to allow diplomacy and sanctions to work, and rejected suggestions that Iran was so close to a nuclear weapon that the situation needed to be resolved “in the next week or two weeks or month or two months.”

The president added that sanctions were starting to squeeze Iran’s oil industry and central bank, and would intensify in coming months. He said that Iran was now signaling that it wanted to return to the negotiating table over its nuclear program, and he emphasized the risks of what he called premature military action.

“It’s also not just an issue of consequences for Israel if action is taken prematurely,” he said. “There are consequences to the United States as well.” As a friend of Israel, he said, it is the job of the United States “to make sure that we provide honest and unvarnished advice.”

Finally, Mr. Obama made clear that when he said the United States “has Israel’s back” — a phrase he used in his speech on Sunday and in the Oval Office with Mr. Netanyahu — it should not be interpreted to mean that he was giving Israel any kind of go-ahead for a pre-emptive strike on Iran.

His statement, Mr. Obama said, was a more general expression of American support for an ally, like Britain or Japan. “It was not a military doctrine that we were laying out for any particular military action,” he said.


Mr. Netanyahu and other Israeli officials attached great importance to Mr. Obama’s statement, on Sunday and at the White House, that Israel had a sovereign right to defend itself.

It was one of four remarks the president made that Israeli officials said they thought had drawn the United States closer to Israel in recent days. The others were Mr. Obama’s vow to prevent Iran from getting a nuclear weapon, his rejection of a policy aimed at containing a nuclear-armed Iran and his explicit reference to military force as an option on the table.

Mr. Netanyahu, in his address to Aipac on Monday, appeared comfortable with the results of his meeting with the president, even as he rejected warnings voiced by Mr. Obama and others that a strike on Iran could unleash even more dangerous consequences for Israel and the United States.

“It’s about time we start talking about the cost of not stopping Iran,” said Mr. Netanyahu, at one point holding up copies of letters from 1944, in which the War Department, the precursor of what is now the Defense Department, rebuffed an appeal by the World Jewish Congress to bomb Auschwitz because, the American officials said, it might drive Nazi Germany to even more “vindictive action.”
- even with Obama's clear hesitancy (relative to the GOP chickenhawks), it feels like we are being carried along by the tide of history.

What is easily forgotten is that N. Korea actually achieved nuclear bomb status under Bush Jr. As much as I have little regard for Bush Jr., I don't think there was a damn thing he or anyone else could of or should of done to stop it - just as it will be with Iran. However, it will not be so easily forgotten that Iran got the bomb under Obama if that turns out to be the coincidence - the GOP will make sure of that.
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Post#247 at 03-07-2012 02:38 PM by Odin [at Moorhead, MN, USA joined Sep 2006 #posts 14,442]
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03-07-2012, 02:38 PM #247
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post
I'm not blaming Obama. The situation is multifaceted and complicated. On the other hand, it doesn't make sense knowing that Israel is hell bent on attacking Iran, then selling them the weapons to do it. Netanyahu is now asking us to supply them with bunker busters.
I think Obama is trying to balance the need to get Bibi Nut-N-Yahoo to quit swinging his dick around with the need to not get into a spat with pro-Israel lobby groups in an election year. I think Netanyahu is doing this saber-rattling now because of the elections here, once Obama gets a 2nd term he won't have to worry about the Israel Lobby, anymore.
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Post#248 at 03-09-2012 11:48 AM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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03-09-2012, 11:48 AM #248
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I wonder how much truth is in the following?

US 'offered Israel new arms to delay Iran attack'

AFP – Thu, Mar 8, 2012

The United States offered Israel advanced weaponry in return for it committing not to attack Iran's nuclear facilities this year, Israeli daily Maariv reported on Thursday.

Citing unnamed Western diplomats and intelligence sources, the report said that during Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's visit to Washington this week, the US administration offered to supply Israel with advanced bunker-busting bombs and long-range refuelling planes.

In return, Israel would agree to put off a possible attack on Iran till 2013, after the US elections in November.

http://news.yahoo.com/us-offered-isr...005157280.html
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#249 at 03-09-2012 11:53 AM by Deb C [at joined Aug 2004 #posts 6,099]
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03-09-2012, 11:53 AM #249
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A response about the White House denial of such a request of Israel to not attack Iran until 2013.

The White House has denied the validity of the reports. “In meetings the president had there was no such agreement proposed or reached,” White House press secretary Jay Carney told reporters. ”We have obviously high-level cooperation between the Israeli military and the U.S. military, and at other levels and with other agencies within their government and our government”, Carney said, adding: “That was not a subject of discussion in the president’s meetings.”But Ha’aretz also quoted an Obama official saying Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu had specifically asked Defense Secretary Leon Panetta for the GBU-28 bunker busting bombs as well as for the advanced refueling aircraft.

Netanyahu told Israeli news media on Thursday that a strike of Iran’s nuclear facilities is not a “matter of days, weeks, but not a matter of years,” adding: “If I don’t make the right call [on Iran] maybe there won’t be anyone to explain to.” This of course completely ignores U.S. intelligence which says Iran is very far off from even deciding to begin development of nuclear weapons.

Whether or not the Obama administration’s deal-cutting was sincere in its attempts to deter reckless Israeli aggression against Iran, it seems clear that giving Israel better capability to unilaterally attack increases the likelihood of it happening.
"The only Good America is a Just America." .... pbrower2a







Post#250 at 03-09-2012 01:32 PM by Marx & Lennon [at '47 cohort still lost in Falwelland joined Sep 2001 #posts 16,709]
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03-09-2012, 01:32 PM #250
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Quote Originally Posted by Deb C View Post
I wonder how much truth is in the following?

US 'offered Israel new arms to delay Iran attack'

AFP – Thu, Mar 8, 2012

The United States offered Israel advanced weaponry in return for it committing not to attack Iran's nuclear facilities this year, Israeli daily Maariv reported on Thursday.

Citing unnamed Western diplomats and intelligence sources, the report said that during Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's visit to Washington this week, the US administration offered to supply Israel with advanced bunker-busting bombs and long-range refuelling planes.

In return, Israel would agree to put off a possible attack on Iran till 2013, after the US elections in November.

http://news.yahoo.com/us-offered-isr...005157280.html
I don't think that even a Nomad is cynical enough to think that handing Netanyahu a few bunker-busters is a smart way to get reelected. Once in hand, the control transfers to the new owner, and Netanyahu is not likely to wait if his political hide is at stake. Remember, the Israelis put themselves first. They've even intentionally attached a US Navy vessel out of concern that it might have been monitoring them prior to the start of the 1967 war.

That attack served the interests of Israel ... and it was under a coalition governement. A fully empowered Likud is even less constrained today.
Marx: Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.
Lennon: You either get tired fighting for peace, or you die.
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