Originally Posted by Marx & Lennon

I don't think that even a Nomad is cynical enough to think that handing Netanyahu a few bunker-busters is a smart way to get reelected. Once in hand, the control transfers to the new owner, and Netanyahu is not likely to wait if his political hide is at stake. Remember, the Israelis put themselves first. They've even intentionally attached a US Navy vessel out of concern that it might have been monitoring them prior to the start of the 1967 war.

That attack served the interests of Israel ... and it was under a coalition governement. A fully empowered Likud is even less constrained today.

The more I read and hear today, it appears there is obviously some very credible information that raise some red flags and concerns about the weapon sales.

This from RootsAction:

While President Obama claims to want Israel not to attack Iran, he has reportedly sold them the weapons to facilitate such an attack, weapons Bush had refused to provide. According to the Israeli newspaperMaariv, Obama has reportedly sold weapons on condition that the attack be delayed until 2013, after the November U.S. election.

SNIP

Meanwhile, President Obama wants to increase to $3.1 billion the weapons that you and I buy for Israel next year, while continuing to protect Israel from accountability at the United Nations or elsewhere.

According to the american thinker secret documents have recently circulated that indicates that the ayatollah has sanctioned the plans for the genocide of the jews that are being drawn up by the iranian jihad council. This, coupled with the alleged attack by an american soldier on civilians in afghanistan is apparently regarded as a prime opportunity to attack by russian, iranian taliban and al-qaeda circles. Most likely the american soldiers was secretly captured an brainwashed by taliban torture agents prior being released to commit his massacre. This would be for the purpose of providing a pretext for the communists and terrorists later action. The enemy's real plan which is the secret deployment for russian, iranian, taliban and al-qaeda sleeper agents across america, europe and elsewhere, these agents would have dozens if not hundreds of suitcase nukes. This would be followed by the detonation of dozens of nukes in numerous american, canadian and european cities. The soviet plan apparently then is for russian troops to invade europe with the purpose of exterminating "inferior beings and subhumans" as well as those groups regarded as "race traitors" by the neo-soviet invaders. At the same time iran will invade the middle east and carry out the nuclear bombardment of israel. Another russian army will invade north america via alaska and canada. The neo-soviets, islamists and terrorists goal is apparently to exterminate all jews, blacks, gypsies, indians, southeast asians, americans (except maybe a handful of neo-nazi types), europeans ( except a small minority deemed "racially uncontaminated"), chinese, africans, latin americans, mixed raced peoples, and many others. After this so-called "cleansing operation" the survivors will be reorganized into "a master race" in which all existing religion will be abolished and replaced by the worship of an evil deity. This deity is in fact mentioned by many religions and is called satan christianity and amolek in the jewish texts. Infanticide would be legalized and children would be educated by being shown so-called "virtues" of murdering innocents and killing the defensless, especially if the defenseless come from "inferior races". Ritual slaughter and other bloody rites would also be legalized in this so-called "utopia". I fear that the majority of us will be dead and in mass graves by the time we reach election day.

Originally Posted by Cynic Hero '86

According to the american thinker secret documents have recently circulated that indicates that the ayatollah has sanctioned the plans for the genocide of the jews that are being drawn up by the iranian jihad council. This, coupled with the alleged attack by an american soldier on civilians in afghanistan is apparently regarded as a prime opportunity to attack by russian, iranian taliban and al-qaeda circles. Most likely the american soldiers was secretly captured an brainwashed by taliban torture agents prior being released to commit his massacre. This would be for the purpose of providing a pretext for the communists and terrorists later action. The enemy's real plan which is the secret deployment for russian, iranian, taliban and al-qaeda sleeper agents across america, europe and elsewhere, these agents would have dozens if not hundreds of suitcase nukes. This would be followed by the detonation of dozens of nukes in numerous american, canadian and european cities. The soviet plan apparently then is for russian troops to invade europe with the purpose of exterminating "inferior beings and subhumans" as well as those groups regarded as "race traitors" by the neo-soviet invaders. At the same time iran will invade the middle east and carry out the nuclear bombardment of israel. Another russian army will invade north america via alaska and canada. The neo-soviets, islamists and terrorists goal is apparently to exterminate all jews, blacks, gypsies, indians, southeast asians, americans (except maybe a handful of neo-nazi types), europeans ( except a small minority deemed "racially uncontaminated"), chinese, africans, latin americans, mixed raced peoples, and many others. After this so-called "cleansing operation" the survivors will be reorganized into "a master race" in which all existing religion will be abolished and replaced by the worship of an evil deity. This deity is in fact mentioned by many religions and is called satan christianity and amolek in the jewish texts. Infanticide would be legalized and children would be educated by being shown so-called "virtues" of murdering innocents and killing the defensless, especially if the defenseless come from "inferior races". Ritual slaughter and other bloody rites would also be legalized in this so-called "utopia". I fear that the majority of us will be dead and in mass graves by the time we reach election day.

Off your meds, again???

Originally Posted by Odin

Off your meds, again???

I've called JDG on making personal attacks and now its time to call you on it. Just put him on ignore.

Originally Posted by The Wonkette

I've called JDG on making personal attacks and now its time to call you on it. Just put him on ignore.

But poking fun at his crazy conspiracy theories is too fun!!!

USS Enterprise - Possible False Flag!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AF0l5I5ZxdE

Do US and Israel want an excuse to start a war with Iran, and need to make it look like Iran started the hostilities, so it is more difficult for Russia and China to support Iran?
Israel has a past history of attacking US war ships and framing others, to trick the US into attacks on Israel's enemies.

The USS Enterprise is on her last legs and scheduled to be decommissioned next year. Decommissioning a nuclear air craft carrier is a very expensive process. The 8 nuclear reactors must all be disposed of as nuclear waste material.

The navy would save a great deal of money if the USS Enterprise was sunk in the Persian Gulf.

Why send an ancient war ship into harms way?

False flags can be preventing by alerting the public to the possibility, so the story would not be believable.

911 did the same way. The insulator of the WTC was asbestos. It was forbidden by the later rule of construction. WTC thus became a hot potato in real estate market. The cost to tear down WTC would be high - equal to build a new one. Then we saw 911, they let insurance company to pay for the money.

It appears that we , once again, are being sold a lie.

From LUV news

Last month, US mass media headlined, using unnamed sources as they so often do in their essential National Security State role, that Iran had refused to cooperate with the UN's International Atomic Energy Agency. Gareth Porter shows we were lied to, in fact Iran cooperated, but sadly, most Americans believe the lie mass media shouted, and repeated, and repeated.


One is reminded of the "weapons of mass destruction" pushed by the mass media in 2003, ignoring US weapons inspector Scott Ritter and UN weapons inspector Hans Blix, both of whom had combed Iraq looking for weapons, with teams of experts. This massive lie "justified" the illegal invasion of Iraq resulting in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocents.

Originally Posted by Deb C

It appears that we , once again, are being sold a lie.

From LUV news

Last month, US mass media headlined, using unnamed sources as they so often do in their essential National Security State role, that Iran had refused to cooperate with the UN's International Atomic Energy Agency. Gareth Porter shows we were lied to, in fact Iran cooperated, but sadly, most Americans believe the lie mass media shouted, and repeated, and repeated.


One is reminded of the "weapons of mass destruction" pushed by the mass media in 2003, ignoring US weapons inspector Scott Ritter and UN weapons inspector Hans Blix, both of whom had combed Iraq looking for weapons, with teams of experts. This massive lie "justified" the illegal invasion of Iraq resulting in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of innocents.

It appears to me that Iran has not really cooperated and sould open up to alleviate concerns.
I agree that should not have invaded Iraq and never saw any evidence that iraq was a threat to the USA. I don't want another 'war ' in the Middle East. However, Iran continues to make controversial threats against Israel.
Iran seems ,whatever their reasons, to promote uncertainty as to their intentions.
Iran must share in the resolution of this potential crisis.

http://www.commonwealthclub.org/even...ssboard-2012-0
George Shultz, Sam Nunn, William Perry: The Nuclear Chessboard, 2012


Thu, Feb 23 2012 - 6:00pm
George Shultz, Sam Nunn, William Perry: The Nuclear Chessboard, 2012


George Shultz, Former U.S Secretary of State under President Reagan
William Perry, Former U.S. Secretary of Defense under President Clinton
Sam Nunn, Former U.S. Senator, Georgia (1972-96), Co-Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of the Nuclear Threat Initiative
Philip Taubman, Consulting Professor, Stanford University Center for International Security and Cooperation; Former New York Times Washington Bureau Chief; Author, The Partnership: Five Cold Warriors and Their Quest to Ban the Bomb – Moderator

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/25/wo...ld-a-bomb.html
..."Iran’s efforts to hide its nuclear facilities and to deceive the West about its activities have also intensified doubts. But some American analysts warn that such behavior is not necessarily proof of a weapons program. They say that one mistake the C.I.A. made before the war in Iraq was to assume that because Saddam Hussein resisted weapons inspections — acting as if he were hiding something — it meant that he had a weapons program."...

Originally Posted by radind

It appears to me that Iran has not really cooperated and sould open up to alleviate concerns.
I agree that should not have invaded Iraq and never saw any evidence that iraq was a threat to the USA. I don't want another 'war ' in the Middle East. However, Iran continues to make controversial threats against Israel.
Iran seems ,whatever their reasons, to promote uncertainty as to their intentions.
Iran must share in the resolution of this potential crisis.

Did you read this report by Gareth Porter who is an investigative historian and journalist specializing in U.S. national security policy?

Turns out that Iran cooperated with the IAEA.

VIENNA, Mar 20, 2012 (IPS) - The first detailed account of negotiations between the International Atomic Energy Agency and Iran last month belies earlier statements by unnamed Western officials portraying Iran as refusing to cooperate with the IAEA in allaying concerns about alleged nuclear weaponisation work.

http://www.ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=107146

Originally Posted by Cynic Hero '86

According to the american thinker secret documents have recently circulated that indicates that the ayatollah has sanctioned the plans for the genocide of the jews that are being drawn up by the iranian jihad council. This, coupled with the alleged attack by an american soldier on civilians in afghanistan is apparently regarded as a prime opportunity to attack by russian, iranian taliban and al-qaeda circles. Most likely the american soldiers was secretly captured an brainwashed by taliban torture agents prior being released to commit his massacre. This would be for the purpose of providing a pretext for the communists and terrorists later action. The enemy's real plan which is the secret deployment for russian, iranian, taliban and al-qaeda sleeper agents across america, europe and elsewhere, these agents would have dozens if not hundreds of suitcase nukes. This would be followed by the detonation of dozens of nukes in numerous american, canadian and european cities. The soviet plan apparently then is for russian troops to invade europe with the purpose of exterminating "inferior beings and subhumans" as well as those groups regarded as "race traitors" by the neo-soviet invaders. At the same time iran will invade the middle east and carry out the nuclear bombardment of israel. Another russian army will invade north america via alaska and canada. The neo-soviets, islamists and terrorists goal is apparently to exterminate all jews, blacks, gypsies, indians, southeast asians, americans (except maybe a handful of neo-nazi types), europeans ( except a small minority deemed "racially uncontaminated"), chinese, africans, latin americans, mixed raced peoples, and many others. After this so-called "cleansing operation" the survivors will be reorganized into "a master race" in which all existing religion will be abolished and replaced by the worship of an evil deity. This deity is in fact mentioned by many religions and is called satan christianity and amolek in the jewish texts. Infanticide would be legalized and children would be educated by being shown so-called "virtues" of murdering innocents and killing the defensless, especially if the defenseless come from "inferior races". Ritual slaughter and other bloody rites would also be legalized in this so-called "utopia". I fear that the majority of us will be dead and in mass graves by the time we reach election day.

Odin, The Wonkette, I believe you just missed a rather rambling piece of irony. This cannot be anything else than a very sarcastic treatment on the so called "conservative" American mind.

Originally Posted by Deb C

Did you read this report by Gareth Porter who is an investigative historian and journalist specializing in U.S. national security policy?

Turns out that Iran cooperated with the IAEA.

VIENNA, Mar 20, 2012 (IPS) - The first detailed account of negotiations between the International Atomic Energy Agency and Iran last month belies earlier statements by unnamed Western officials portraying Iran as refusing to cooperate with the IAEA in allaying concerns about alleged nuclear weaponisation work.

http://www.ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=107146

I did read the report, but do not belive his claim that Iran cooperated. My take is that Iran is playing hide and seek, which does not lead to trust.

The problem is that no one knows for certain what is in the mind of another person, so we have to rely of the best information available and try to reach reasonable conclusions.
I have found Stratfor to be useful as one source of information:

Signs of U.S.-Iranian Truce | Stratfor;March 8, 2012 | 1234 GMT
http://www.stratfor.com/analysis/signs-us-iranian-truce

..."Despite the political pressures he was facing at home over the question of U.S. support for Israel against Iran, Obama was exceedingly cautious in responding to the war rhetoric. While maintaining that the military option remained viable, he said in a March 4 speech that "now is not the time for bluster," and that "loose talk of war" only works to Iran's advantage by driving up oil prices, providing it with more revenue to develop its nuclear program. Indeed, Khamenei has even recently articulated that the strength of Iran's foreign policy is that it has to do very little to disturb the oil markets and can rely simply on "threats against threats" to maintain its advantage over its adversaries. Obama also reiterated that more time is needed to allow pressure to sink in from the sanctions effort, and he stressed that a diplomatic path is the most appropriate way forward.

The two leaders' recent speeches come after a quiet U.S. attempt to restart backchannel negotiations with Iran in early January with a letter from Obama requesting direct talks with Tehran. Shortly thereafter, the United States announced it would delay joint military exercises with Israel, and Iran, in turn, indefinitely postponed exercises in theStrait of Hormuz.

Khamenei's positive reaction to Obama's statements over the past week represents another likely indicator that Iran is interested in negotiating with the United States. The supreme leader's statements come as Iran prepares to re-enter negotiations over its nuclear program with the P-5+1 group in Turkey in April. Neither side appears ready for a strategic accommodation, but as Iran tries to regain room to maneuver from sanctions and Obama tries to lower military tensions as he seeks re-election, there are signs of a fragile truce."

Bill Moyers interviews Andrew Bacevich about Iran.

Preview: Moving Beyond War

March 21, 2012

Nine years after Baghdad erupted in “shock and awe,” we’re once again hearing in America the drumbeat for war in the Middle East. Now, the bull’s-eye is on Iran. But what we need more than a simple change of target is a complete change in perspective, says Andrew Bacevich, a West Point graduate and Vietnam veteran-turned-scholar who’s become one of the most perceptive observers of America’s changing role in the world.

This week, on an all-new Moyers & Company (check local listings), Bill Moyers and Bacevich explore the futility of “endless” wars, and provide a reality check on the rhetoric of American exceptionalism.

“Are we so unimaginative, so wedded to the reliance on military means that we cannot conceive of any way to reconcile our differences with groups and nations in the Islamic world, and therefore bring this conflict to an end?” Bacevich tells Moyers.

Bacevich also answers the question of whether Iran is a direct threat to America with a definitive no. “Whatever threat Iran poses is very, very limited,” he tells Moyers, “and certainly does not constitute any kind of justification for yet another experiment with preventive war.”

More: http://billmoyers.com/episode/previe...ng-beyond-war/

Originally Posted by Deb C

Bill Moyers interviews Andrew Bacevich about Iran.

Preview: Moving Beyond War

March 21, 2012

Nine years after Baghdad erupted in “shock and awe,” we’re once again hearing in America the drumbeat for war in the Middle East. Now, the bull’s-eye is on Iran. But what we need more than a simple change of target is a complete change in perspective, says Andrew Bacevich, a West Point graduate and Vietnam veteran-turned-scholar who’s become one of the most perceptive observers of America’s changing role in the world.

This week, on an all-new Moyers & Company (check local listings), Bill Moyers and Bacevich explore the futility of “endless” wars, and provide a reality check on the rhetoric of American exceptionalism.

“Are we so unimaginative, so wedded to the reliance on military means that we cannot conceive of any way to reconcile our differences with groups and nations in the Islamic world, and therefore bring this conflict to an end?” Bacevich tells Moyers.

Bacevich also answers the question of whether Iran is a direct threat to America with a definitive no. “Whatever threat Iran poses is very, very limited,” he tells Moyers, “and certainly does not constitute any kind of justification for yet another experiment with preventive war.”

More: http://billmoyers.com/episode/previe...ng-beyond-war/

I have not seen this interview( except for the preview) but I totally agree that Iran does not pose a direct military threat to the USA. There is concern for the world's oil supply if Iran is attacked. Iran could bring the tensions down by fully cooperating with the inspectors and by stopping the threats against Israel. I am opposed to all unnecessary wars and all nation building.
We could do better and so could Iran. China and Russia could also help if they wanted to. Unfortunately the competition seems to be more important to the international players than peace.

Originally Posted by radind

I am opposed to all unnecessary wars and all nation building.

We could do better and so could Iran. China and Russia could also help if they wanted to. Unfortunately the competition seems to be more important to the international players than peace.

We are in agreement.

Originally Posted by The Wonkette

I've called JDG on making personal attacks and now its time to call you on it...

-Pointing out that someone has dirtbag tendencies by reminding everyone what they themselves have already posted really doesn't constitute a "personal attack."

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7165/6488093197_cd253f990b_z.jpg

Map of US Bases Surrounding The Iranian Threat
Dec 10, 2011

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7006/6488270237_59d72350d6_z.jpg

Iran military spending compare with US and other Mid-east countries.

Originally Posted by katsung47

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7165/6488093197_cd253f990b_z.jpg

Map of US Bases Surrounding The Iranian Threat
Dec 10, 2011

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7006/6488270237_59d72350d6_z.jpg

Iran military spending compare with US and other Mid-east countries.

Looks like a clear picture to me. Thanks.

Originally Posted by Deb C

Looks like a clear picture to me. Thanks.

-Wow. Katsung has a new fan...

I would hope that we learn from these lies.

Man whose WMD lies led to 100,000 deaths confesses all

Defector tells how US officials 'sexed up' his fictions to make the case for 2003 invasion

A man whose lies helped to make the case for invading Iraq – starting a nine-year war costing more than 100,000 lives and hundreds of billions of pounds – will come clean in his first British television interview tomorrow.


"Curveball", the Iraqi defector who fabricated claims about Iraq's weapons of mass destruction, smiles as he confirms how he made the whole thing up. It was a confidence trick that changed the course of history, with Rafid Ahmed Alwan al-Janabi's lies used to justify the Iraq war.


He tries to defend his actions: "My main purpose was to topple the tyrant in Iraq because the longer this dictator remains in power, the more the Iraqi people will suffer from this regime's oppression."

The chemical engineer claimed to have overseen the building of a mobile biological laboratory when he sought political asylum in Germany in 1999. His lies were presented as "facts and conclusions based on solid intelligence" by Colin Powell, US Secretary of State, when making the case for war at the UN Security Council in February 2003.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...l-7606236.html

715. War as a distraction in April 14 plot (4/14/2012)

The Feds used to create big events to distract the framed case as I always said. In this April 14 plot they prepared a war.

1. War crisis in Korea Peninsula. North Korea announced to launch a ballistical missile between 4/12 to 4/16. The core date is 4/14.

2. War on Iran.

　

World powers to hold talks with Iran on April 14:

BRUSSELS | Sun Apr 8, 2012
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/04/08/us-iran-nuclear-ashton-idUKBRE8370BD20120408

　
It's not a talk. It's an ultimatun. A war could have happened any time at US' will when April 14 talks started. Simply because Iran won't accept a "surrender" demand. Here is the rare report news:
　

US Gives Iran 'Last Chance' Warning

Obama demands concessions as crucial talks begin in Istanbul later this week


By Guy Adams

April 09, 2012 "The Independent" - -Iran must immediately close a large nuclear facility built underneath a mountain if it is to take what President Obama has called a "last chance" to resolve its escalating dispute with the West via diplomacy.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article31029.htm

US Offers to 'Negotiate' if Iran Surrenders;

　
Thoughts on Negotiation Tactics; Obama Threatens War



By Mike Shedlock

April 09, 2012 "Information Clearing House" --- President Obama has stepped up the rhetoric against Iran with an offer to "negotiate". His offer is no offer at all, it is a demand to surrender.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article31034.htm

3. Eliminate any possible anti-war voice. Based on his religious stance, Pope will certainly against any new war. At this time, if the Iran war happens, his voice will be absent. Watch the time coincidence.
　

Could it Be? Another Resignation? "Pope Benedict to step down April 15 2012″ from Kauilapele's Blog
　
Posted by
Ram Arjuna on March 9, 2012 at 12:00pm
http://2013rainbowroundtable.ning.com/profiles/blogs/could-it-be-another-resignation-pope-benedict-to-step-down-april-

Originally Posted by Deb C

I would hope that we learn from these lies.

Man whose WMD lies led to 100,000 deaths confesses all

Defector tells how US officials 'sexed up' his fictions to make the case for 2003 invasion



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...l-7606236.html

The invasion of Iraq was a mistake. The question on what threat Iran poses is still murky and Iran does nothing to settle this.

Originally Posted by radind

The invasion of Iraq was a mistake. The question on what threat Iran poses is still murky and Iran does nothing to settle this.

Iran and Iraq once balanced each other out. Once we trashed Iraq, Iran started to loom a lot larger. And the nations now in 4T have jumped upon them as a plausible enemy, lacking, I suppose, a menace right in their faces. That's all.

Iranian terrorists were trained in the U.S. by the U.S.

　

April 6, 2012
Our Men in Iran?
Posted by Seymour M. Hersh

The site, some sixty-five miles northwest of Las Vegas, was once used for nuclear testing, and now includes a counterintelligence training facility and a private airport capable of handling Boeing 737 aircraft. It’s a restricted area, and inhospitable—in certain sections, the curious are warned that the site’s security personnel are authorized to use deadly force, if necessary, against intruders.

It was here that the Joint Special Operations Command (JSOC) conducted training, beginning in 2005, for members of the Mujahideen-e-Khalq, a dissident Iranian opposition group known in the West as the M.E.K.


Read more http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/newsdesk/2012/04/mek.html#ixzz1rlhIF1vj

US envoy to Israel: US ready to strike Iran

By AMY TEIBEL | Associated Press –
5/17/2012
JERUSALEM (AP) — The U.S. has plans in place to attack Iran if necessary to prevent it from developing nuclear weapons, Washington's envoy to Israel said, days ahead of a crucial round of nuclear talks with Tehran.
http://news.yahoo.com/us-envoy-israel-us-ready-strike-iran-152828071.html